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Top UN legal investigators conclude Israel is guilty of genocide in Gaza

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Re: Top UN legal investigators conclude Israel is guilty of genocide in Gaza

#721
post #555

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For anyone else not familiar with "anti-BDS": "Anti-BDS laws are legislation that retaliate against those that engage in Boycott, Divestment and Sanctions. With regard to the Arab–Israeli conflict, many supporters of the State of Israel have often advocated or implemented anti-BDS laws, which effectively seek to retaliate against people and organizations engaged in boycotts of Israel-affiliated entities." From Wikipe…

From a historical, economic, social perspective... Why does Israel hold so much power over the world?

Worth having a listen to Aaron Good, author of 'American Exception' being interviewed by Jeffrey Sachs: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jXvuOG33zLs

Some of the gist of what he talks about:

Just as there is an 'underworld', there is also a corresponding and related 'overworld'. Essentially organised crime, corporations, and security services cooperating in nefarious ways (often usurping - though not always violently - the power of states).

It's arguable that Israel is particularly interested and involved in this 'overworld'. See the early history of the CIA, FBI, Meyer Lansky and the mob, Epstein, the reach and effectiveness of Mossad relative to other similar organisations, etc.

Call me a conspiracy theorist if you like, but I believe that most significant western leaders have probably been compromised in some way by 'overworld' influences. Look at what happens to 'the wrong type of candidate' that gets too close to power. Jeremy Corban was thoroughly and dishonestly scandalised by a campaign instigated and supported by Israeli interests. Why? The complete bandwagon type behaviour of mainstream British press of the left and right in that campaign is very reminiscent of the way recent mainstream media coverage reports on Gaza - it looks coordinated and in unison.

Of course, I'm probably wrong. Just trying to make sense of the madness I see around me.

TLDR; My theory is that Israel has corrupted our media and politicians through a nexus of nefarious actors that Aaron Good refers to as the 'overworld'.

Re: Top UN legal investigators conclude Israel is guilty of genocide in Gaza

#722
post #525

Seeing PG slowly turn on this issue, from nothing into recognition and now into advocacy has been wild. Presumably because he has kids, and like many parents you understand with your eyes first, and then your heart. PG wields some amount of power in SV, but YC and others are still inextricably tied to what's happening. Thiel was just in Israel with elad gil, rabois, alex karp, joe lonsdale. It's just too much to list…

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Re: Top UN legal investigators conclude Israel is guilty of genocide in Gaza

#723

Earlier quoted context omitted.

He is, he regularly posts about it on X. I really admire his commitment to ethics. It says a lot that even for him, it must be difficult.

My best friend since childhood is Jewish and has a difficult time even acknowledging there is an issue. My other friend works for an Israeli company and the jokes are about what they’re going to do with the flattened Gaza land. I’m not sure which is worse. In one case ignoring it and pretending your morality is in tact, on the other being crass but knowing full well no one will stop this until it’s too late (as plann…

I suppose the question is why do they remain your friends? What is the threshold at which you'd stop calling them that?

Re: Top UN legal investigators conclude Israel is guilty of genocide in Gaza

#724

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why would we expect any desirable outcome in this hypothetical though? So the US flips, Israel is pressured into withdrawing, Hamas regains control of the strip and resumes rocket attacks, Israel is forced to respond eventually. It doesn't seem like a path toward a real solution.

It's the same liberal psychology behind UNSC Resolution 1701 in 2006 where Hezbollah pinkie promised to disarm. And now look at all the dead bodies that this liberal solution caused 18 years later. Of course the same types propose the same solutions again with no sense of shame as to how much death it causes. The actual durable solution is something like how Sri Lanka defeated the Tamil Tigers, or how Russia defeated…

Hezbollah are supported by Iran, who don't get mentioned enough in this conflict. Iran is quite happy to maintain the conflict at the cost of Palestinian and Lebanese lives.

Re: Top UN legal investigators conclude Israel is guilty of genocide in Gaza

#726

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Surely if a surrender takes place, it will be merely symbolic. I cannot imagine anyone can convince a population so terrorized to forgive or forget.

Japanese civilians experienced far worse in WW2, and they forgot pretty quickly. The war against the Tamil Tigers would be another case study. Once the radicalism is dealt with by force, the ratcheting of violence is reduced, and people move on.

> they forgot pretty quickly

There was a huge Allied reconstruction effort in Japan (and Germany, and a lot of Europe, and elsewhere). I very much doubt there would be something similar for Palestine. Or Syria. Or, like in Iraq and Afghanistan, there would be an effort which spent a huge amount of money for zero effect outside the US compound.

Re: Top UN legal investigators conclude Israel is guilty of genocide in Gaza

#727

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Consider that the videos of Oct 7 had a similar effect on lots of decent people. The un is the same now as it was before October 7. In gueterres words "it didn't happen in a vacuum". The complete loss of credibility for the un also didn't happen in a vacuum. Even if their report is true it will fall on deaf ears thanks in no small part to their lack of any sort of objectivity when it comes to Israel.

That is interesting, why videos from Gaza has strong effects while Oct 7 don't. Or videos from Ukraine don't. Israel bombing a hospital in Gaza is genocide while russians bombing child hospital in Kyiv is ok. Unfortunately not all nations are equal and many suffers because of that.

Unfortunately truth is: western societies don't actually give a shit about either. It just a "popular" trend to support Palestine / Gaza and for a while that was Ukraine. But reality is that people don't really care enough about any of it. Just like they didn't care about wars in Africa, genocide in Cambodia, etc.

To actually solve big world problems it would take massive investments and sacrifice quality of life for many and increase taxes on rich. Obviously no one would agree. It's way beyond clicking "like" and "repost" buttons on social app or adding UTF-8 country flag to your name.

Re: Top UN legal investigators conclude Israel is guilty of genocide in Gaza

#729

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think at the moment a term like "genocide" is still floating free from the reality of what that term means. Here's an interview with a senior UNICEF worker: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NsAo2j6aih0 I think after that I can't imagine the question, "will this impact israel?" makes any sense. They're deliberately perpetrating a genocide. It's real. It's the deliberate and systematic murder of two million people. I…

There's no murder of two million. There's at most, according to Hamas itself, 60,000 dead out of which 10,000 were hamas militants. This is a regular ugly war. If Israel wanted to kill two million, they could've done it already. It seemingly doesn't matter how accurate Israel tried to be, they call genocide either way.

It's incredibly difficult to kill two million people, the easiest -- if not the only practically possible way -- is with mass starvation.

Here's an interview with a senior UNICEF worker: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NsAo2j6aih0

You may want to distance yourself from a defense of israel. This is not what you think it is; within a year a very large percentage of gazans will be dead, a very significant majority of all their children. They are starving now with water withheld. You can kill a large number very quickly if you withhold water.

That's where we are. Israel's actions have becoming increasingly genocidal as they have ratched up the "genocidal escalation ladder" with impunity. They had been afraid that someone would step in, but none have.

There's now no way of reversing at least 20% of the population dying, it's really just a question of whether they can finish them off, at least as a peoples with a need and claim to that land. If they can be whittled down to a small fraction of their original population, they can then be ethnically cleansed.

I'd imagine that has been the plan now for at least a year, or at least, most of this one.

Re: Top UN legal investigators conclude Israel is guilty of genocide in Gaza

#730
post #642

Earlier quoted context omitted.

From a historical, economic, social perspective... Why does Israel hold so much power over the world?

what power exactly Israel holds over the world ?

Threats of assassination, and other dirty intelligence operations to blackmail and coerce politicians. Lavish gifts, paid vacations and campaign assistance for any politician who plays ball. Nuclear threats. Religious influence.
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