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OpenAI to become for-profit company

reuters.com

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Re: OpenAI to become for-profit company

#721
post #551

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Any case where someone's work was used without respecting the terms is included in my answer. That's why I used `et cetera` here: > The work of artists, authors, etc.

I wanted to make sure I understood which side of the equation I fell on. And I must say, it looks to me like a lot of people in the "weak" camp aren't helpless martyrs though, myself included. People are excited and enthusiastic about AI and are actively reaping the benefits of progress. I don't think your analogy is quite apt.

> a lot of people in the "weak" camp

Define "a lot"? Most people barely know how to use their email. Even among the minority who do actively use "AI" and excited about it, outside of ML engineers they aren't well-informed or aware what data is used for training, or even what training means and how these models work to begin with.

> People are excited and enthusiastic about AI and are actively reaping the benefits of progress.

Except the terms were already violated in the initial training phase before the services were even public and saw adoption. That's like pointing at a rape victim who got some form of compensation later, saying:

  see how she's "reaping the benefits"
So let's not play the people wanted it card.

By the time some people started raising concerns, OpenAI claimed the cat was already out of the bag and "if we didn't do it, someone else will, so deal with it."

Similar to privacy, just because some people don't care, lack awareness, or don't want the hassle of fighting for it, doesn't justify taking it away from others.

Re: OpenAI to become for-profit company

#722
post #586

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>What matters is that they wanted the public (and likely, their talent) to _think_ that they weren't even interested in making a profit as this would be a philosophical threat to the notion of any sort of impartial or even hopefully benevolent originator of AGI (a goal which is laid plainly in their mission statement) And now they want to cast off any pretense of that former altruistic yolk now that they have a new,…

Note Elon made a significant "donation" early into OpenAI given their non-profit designation and intentions, in return receiving zero equity. The donation was also received tax free

He received a seat on the board, which he surrendered when Tesla started investing in AI.

Re: OpenAI to become for-profit company

#724
post #575

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sam: "I'm not in it for the money. I have principles." World: "But what if it was like, a lot of money?" Sam: "Oh alright you convinced me. Fuck my principles."

What do you do with a a lot of money past a point? A corporate controlled AGI being just a stop on the way to build another private space agency seems like a...letdown.

Let me recommend my favourite TikTok/YouTube channel of late, The Forest Jar

what annoys you?: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k9Le1ibX2zY

> if you went to a group of investors and pitched a board game where the winners get space ships and the losers die, they'd call you crazy. But if you suggested to those same investors that perhaps we shouldn't organize our entire society that way, they'd call you crazy.

Re: OpenAI to become for-profit company

#725

I can't help but wonder if things would be different if Sam Altman wasn't allowed to come back to OpenAI. Instead, the safeguards are gone, challengers have left the company, and the bottom line is now the new priority. All in opposition to ushering in AI advancement with the caution and respect it deserves.

Things would be different for sure. I wonder if people leaving OpenAI has something to do with the prosaic comparison of what they are getting (a salary) and what he's getting (a cool $10B at the current valuation).

Re: OpenAI to become for-profit company

#726
post #720
post #685

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Proto-Indo-European culture seems to have placed a great deal of importance on the sanctity of contracts and the notion of reciprocal hospitality, reflected in many descendant myths and etymologies surviving from Ireland through India. If the Indo-Europeans did indeed come from the Ukrainian steppes, as seems likely, this may be a reflection of their high mobility (on horseback) causing lots of contact with potential…

> Proto-Indo-European culture seems to have placed a great deal of importance on the sanctity of contracts and the notion of reciprocal hospitality ... There's some great books on Indo-European society if you're interested. What are those books?

For PIE, the most accessible recent book in English is probably The Horse, the Wheel, and Language (Anthony 2007), and I would highly recommend it. (It pulls double duty as a laymen's and as an academic publication, so if you do read it, know that it's OK to skip the minutiae of pottery shards.)

A slightly older but enduringly popular work is In Search of the Indo-Europeans: Language, Archaeology, and Myth (Mallory 1989). I'm told How to Kill a Dragon: Aspects of Indo-European Poetics (Watkins 1995) is very good too, but I have not read it myself.

Chapter 2 of Indo-European Language and Culture: An Introduction (Fortson 2004) is a very good summary of PIE culture. The book is excellent in general - probably the best English language introduction to PIE linguistics at the moment - but outside the first two chapters it is not generally accessible to laymen.

If you read other European languages it's worth checking out other books that may be available to you. The field by definition requires the ability to read a decent number of languages, so the literature is spread out across English, German, French, Russian, etc.

Re: OpenAI to become for-profit company

#727

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's about the narrative they tried to create. The spin. It doesn't matter much if they were technically behaving as a for-profit entity previously. What matters is that they wanted the public (and likely, their talent) to _think_ that they weren't even interested in making a profit as this would be a philosophical threat to the notion of any sort of impartial or even hopefully benevolent originator of AGI (a goal wh…

Occam's razor: I think Sam's personal narrative is the correct one. He built a non-profit that took off in a way that he didn't expect it and now a for-profit is the best way to run the lightning they've caught. In terms of profit, AFAICT, Sam doesn't have designs on building extra large yachts and his own space agency but what he wants is to be the one at the stead of building what he considers is world-changing tec…

Occam's razor has never meant "let's take discourse at face value".

That's not least complexity. That's least effort.

Re: OpenAI to become for-profit company

#728
post #703
post #184

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Difficult to see how these two stories aren't related. OpenAI has been one of the most insane business stories in years. I can't wait to read a full book about it that isn't written by either Walter Isaacson or Michael Lewis.

I want Chuck Palahniuk to write the book. It would be dark and amazing.

love chuck because the third act would be sam eating his own head while realising AGI was created to delete itself and taking away everything that is his

Re: OpenAI to become for-profit company

#729
post #610

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I was under the impression that in UK law at least, (and obviously not in this case) the trustees of a non-profit would be bound to work in the best interests of that non-profit. And so allowing an asset like this to somehow slip out of their control would be the sort of negligence that would land you in very hot water. I'd be interested to know how this isn't the case here.

> somehow slip out of their control would be the sort of negligence that would land you in very hot water. > how this isn't the case here. Its not the case because they are doing the opposite of what you are suggesting. They are increasing the value of the asset that they own. Sure, the asset itself is being diluted, but the individual parts that it owns are more valuable. It is perfectly reasonable for a non profit…

Isn't the goal of a non-profit by its very definition... not profit?

The goal of the openAI non-profit is something something control the development of AI for the good of all humanity, then it seems that they explicitly shouldn't care about making $20 billion, and explicitly should care about maintaining control of openAI.

If you listen to their rhetoric, $20 billion is peanuts compared to the lightcone and the kardashev scale and whatever else.

Re: OpenAI to become for-profit company

#730
post #586

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's about the narrative they tried to create. The spin. It doesn't matter much if they were technically behaving as a for-profit entity previously. What matters is that they wanted the public (and likely, their talent) to _think_ that they weren't even interested in making a profit as this would be a philosophical threat to the notion of any sort of impartial or even hopefully benevolent originator of AGI (a goal wh…

>What matters is that they wanted the public (and likely, their talent) to _think_ that they weren't even interested in making a profit as this would be a philosophical threat to the notion of any sort of impartial or even hopefully benevolent originator of AGI (a goal which is laid plainly in their mission statement) And now they want to cast off any pretense of that former altruistic yolk now that they have a new,…

It sort of remains to be seen whether they can actually make that cash - they're no longer the only game in town, and while they have an obvious adoption and brand name recognition advantage in their industry, they've also been running real hot on investor funding on the assumption that more processing power is what it's gonna take for them to stay competitive and continue improving. But they're gonna have to fight Google and Microsoft on that front. If there is a general plateau coming up in all of these models, or they fail to keep pace with their extremely well-supplied competition, it might not be so easy to convert their position into money.
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