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Why banks are suddenly closing down customer accounts

nytimes.com

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Re: Why banks are suddenly closing down customer accounts

#721

Post by dboreham »

csomar wrote: post #619
dboreham wrote: post #490

I didn't get de-banked, but I had a similar wacky experience last year with Wells Fargo. I was buying a car from a guy in Salt Lake City. Not a terribly expensive car. I live in Montana but at the time I was physically in Northern California on a trip. I'd driven to SLC and looked at the car, met the seller, and done various things to ensure I knew his identity (e.g. he used his work email and he had a medium profile…

This is not the same. The bank did not kick you out as a customer but just locked you out for your "protection". Or more like their "protection" in case it turns out not to be you and you demand the money back.

I said it's not the same thing, but they did kick me out as a customer, for a day. And it's the same in that it was caused by some irrational actor (people or people who manage software). If they wanted to just prevent me from sending money to a Nigerian Prince, they could have a) only blocked the wire, not locked my multiple personal and business accounts and b) told me I had to perform XYZ additional steps to get the wire unblocked. Instead they silently disabled account access then generated a spiral of BS, exasperation and time wasting, for a day.

Re: Why banks are suddenly closing down customer accounts

#722

Post by plagiarist »

kylebenzle wrote: post #640
ArabicBaklava wrote: post #494

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, this happened in 2017.. fast forward to this account closure effect on my life: I had to go back to my country, without a degree, was not able to land any job. Unfortunately, good places require degrees. Stayed unemployed, hit with chronic depression as anyone would. Lost 4+ years of professional progress. When covid came, i was able to complete my degree online and graduated in 2021, but because all fresh grad…

You should have switched Bitcoin LONG ago. Soon we will have to stop having sympathy for people who get screwed by the banks as the alternative is just too easy and obvious.

I think I'll wait for you all to finish the "why financial regulations exist" speedrun before I use it day-to-day.

Re: Why banks are suddenly closing down customer accounts

#723

Post by toss1 »

trompetenaccoun wrote: post #523
ArabicBaklava wrote: post #494

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, this happened in 2017.. fast forward to this account closure effect on my life: I had to go back to my country, without a degree, was not able to land any job. Unfortunately, good places require degrees. Stayed unemployed, hit with chronic depression as anyone would. Lost 4+ years of professional progress. When covid came, i was able to complete my degree online and graduated in 2021, but because all fresh grad…

Horrible. I've heard similar stories but this one's the worst by far. This shouldn't be allowed to ever happen again, such sudden closures without warning need to be illegal. The issue is banking is highly regulated but a lot of the regulation is about AML, terrorism screening and such. Not actually protecting customers from abuse but rather the other way around - banks are taking precautions to protect themselves fr…

You're on the right track, but cryptocurrency has unfortunately shown repeatedly that it is not the solution (nevermind the ubiquitous fraud, scammers, but nearly 2 decades in, there is no good easy-to-use and secure system, the UX sucks).

It does appear necessary to spread your risk across multiple unrelated financial institutions. Make multiple bank & ccard accounts, and do not link them. Far less convenient, but should improve your safety.

Re: Why banks are suddenly closing down customer accounts

#724

Post by fastaguy88 »

fencepost wrote: post #112
raincom wrote: post #85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, they sent me a cashier check for a small balance (around $1000) I left, as Chase gave me 45 days heads up for closure. However, for some people, Chase dragged out until after CFPB complaints are filed. The case one should worry about these banks is this: you deposit a $500K check, or you got a wire for $500K; check was cleared on the sender's side. Now Chase/Big Bank holds your funds, saying that this check is f…

I'm very far from dealing with 500k personal banking transactions, but my immediate thought is that if you're doing so you're probably making mistakes. If it's revenue from sale of a company or similar, move it through escrow with your attorney. If it's a legal settlement, do the same. If you don't have an attorney but are dealing with hundreds of thousands of dollars, get an attorney. If it's income from trading or…

If you are buying a house with cash, you are likely to be transferring $500K+. I do not think an attorney is necessary for the transfer.

Re: Why banks are suddenly closing down customer accounts

#725

Post by nativeit »

kcatskcolbdi wrote: post #654
mcny wrote: post #544

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> There is a solution - not sure if everyone's ready to hear it yet: Decentralized finance. I want the pendulum to swing the other way. Everybody gets and gets to keep forever an account at the Reserve Bank. > self-hosted Ethereum wallet I'm sorry. The technology might be fine But I simply do not trust the people involved with cryptocurrency. Not just the scammers such as SBF, I don't trust the "victims" to make wise…

> I want the pendulum to swing the other way. Everybody gets and gets to keep forever an account at the Reserve Bank. I believe this would result in more instances of funds being frozen when under the suspicion of doing something/being associated with someone doing something illegal. Just as Social Security was promised to never be used as a national ID, but was ultimately used as an identification mechanism[1], acco…

Providing the account != requiring its use

Re: Why banks are suddenly closing down customer accounts

#726

Post by mcny »

bombcar wrote: post #702
CaptainZapp wrote: post #647

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why didn't you politely suggest to call Wells Fargo' central phone number and have the switch board transfer you to him? Seems pretty much a no brainer to me.

It should be standard for all banks that if they have a fraud issue, they call you and tell you to call the number on the back of your card, and press 6 or something. The fraud departments we have are so indistinguishable from actual phishing it’s amazing. They even send you a two factor code and have you read it to them! The text says they’ll never ask for it via phone! Embarrassing.

Worse, as a customer, it is almost impossible to reach a specific person at a bank over the phone.

The branch manager who called had to authenticate himself over the phone (at least he was the one who placed the call) and waited on hold for over twenty minutes and even then he didn't talk to a specific person iirc.

The strange thing is the supervisor was clearly on a power trip. They made me waste hours of my life chasing this nonsense.

Re: Why banks are suddenly closing down customer accounts

#727

Post by sgjohnson »

plagiarist wrote: post #708
fragmede wrote: post #574

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A crypto currency pegged to the dollar won't "go to the moon". If you're looking for that, there's USDT. Unfortunately, when trying to pick a coin, it's like trying to choose the best programming language. Each coin has its own ins and outs, there isn't one that is the best. They have their own time and place. A lot of people see this and want to use them in inappropriate places, but doesn't mean there aren't appropr…

I was under the impression that all of the "pegged to the dollar" coins are too fragile for storing money long term. But USDT dropped down to 94 cents during the crash I was thinking of when others more thoroughly collapsed. What's the difference there?

> But USDT dropped down to 94 cents during the crash

While that is true, they were redeeming them 1:1. So you could buy them at a 6% discount on the exchange, but redeem them, for free 6%.

Few people did because enough of them thought that USDT is going to the ground, causing the discount.

Re: Why banks are suddenly closing down customer accounts

#728

Post by kylebenzle »

lamontcg wrote: post #186
advael wrote: post #162

I'm somewhat surprised no one here views this as an automated decisionmaking problem It's increasingly clear that automating important decisions like this is causing a lot of harm while removing most forms of recourse available to those affected. Coupled with the way automated decisions are used to perform and then launder fraud on a massive scale, maybe we should target laws at the automation itself: Require decisio…

Yeah we need strong anti-Kafka laws so that individuals can always find out what they've been "charged" with and that there always need to be an "appeal" process and businesses are strictly denied the ability to claim that they can't reveal their methods.

They can't even get the legal system to function, how are they going to fix ALL corporations?

Some of best examples are the juvenile and and family court systems in a state like Ohio. Not only do they not even TRY to do what is fair or right, they have one simple mandate, pay for their own existence. As soon as the system set up to punish children is made to profit off those same children you have a sick and broken system but thats where we are today. So, VERY little chance we are going to convince a company to make less money for the social good when even out children's courts are run like a business.

Re: Why banks are suddenly closing down customer accounts

#729

Post by sgjohnson »

j-a-a-p wrote: post #599
neonsunset wrote: post #518

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I wonder if the bank can be sued for this. That's how random bank managers get found in a river, due to policies like these impacting the innocent.

OTOH I do hope a bank is allowed to go full stop on the brakes if needed. I had my CC blocked 4 times because of fraud detection. All done by the CC company and it never cost me anything but inconvenience. If the bank would be liable, we all suffer. How much will banks charge if we would be both secured from fraud risks and indemnified from account closure damages? I would think 1% of your cashflow would not be unrea…

Banks are almost never liable for fraudulent CC charges. The merchant picks up the tab just about every time.

Re: Why banks are suddenly closing down customer accounts

#730

Post by manojlds »

pc86 wrote: post #680
ta1243 wrote: post #655

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How long did the bank hold on to your money? To me that says "talk to us before the deadline if you've got problems paying". What did they say when you said your bank was having problems?

I don't have any context into OP's story that isn't in this thread, but there's no legal requirement for a bank to immediately give you access to your funds if your account is closed, especially if its closed for suspicious activity. My wife had a PNC account closed when she was in college and their official position was that they would mail a cashier's check to the address on the account within 90 days. I'd be shock…

They said they got access in 1 week. That they got their roll in univ revoked in 1 week that happened to have a long weekend is dubious sounding either side - it all happened in 1 week feels tooshort on univ side or 1 week sounds too short on the bank side
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