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Claude Code is being dumbed down?

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Re: Claude Code is being dumbed down?

#711

Post by Wowfunhappy »

giancarlostoro wrote: post #688
bcherny wrote: post #386

Hey, Boris from the Claude Code team here. I wanted to take a sec to explain the context for this change. One of the hard things about building a product on an LLM is that the model frequently changes underneath you. Since we introduced Claude Code almost a year ago, Claude has gotten more intelligent, it runs for longer periods of time, and it is able to more agentically use more tools. This is one of the magical th…

What is the best way to get you guys feedback? There's a few things I tell Claude Code to do every project that I feel like Claude should just do by default, the biggest one is instead of using Grep so much, I have ripgrep installed, it makes searching for text inside the current folder so much easier and it is insanely faster. Claude seems to work way faster when it uses ripgrep, I don't know if its because MCP has…

Claude’s search tool _does_ use use ripgrep—ripgrep literally ships with Cluade Code. I guess the agent can also decide to invoke `grep` directly instead of using its search tool. I usually only see it do this for small searches…

Re: Claude Code is being dumbed down?

#712

Post by mbesto »

tripledry wrote: post #622
mbesto wrote: post #464

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> if it's complex: it's going to the smartest person in the room. That has never been the PM. Yet the PM always has the last say on what goes in the product, NOT the engineer. Funny how that works... None of your conclusions are consistent with experience (interviewed 900+ SaaS management teams)

In my average experience, without interviewing management teams - my observation is that the "smartest person in the room" is rarely the one deciding anything. This also depends on your definition on "smartest".

> This also depends on your definition on "smartest".

Which the parent conveniently left out a definition of. I sort of ignored that implication and went straight to the point - which is it doesn't matter if the PM is the smartest or not. What matters is who makes the decisions and typically the PM does.

Re: Claude Code is being dumbed down?

#713

Post by elzbardico »

johndough wrote: post #664
elzbardico wrote: post #636

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Deepseek lies about costs systematically. This is just another fantasy.

What do you base your accusations on? Is there a specific number from the link above that you claim is a lie? And how are 7 other providers able to offer DeepSeek API access at roughly the same price as DeepSeek? https://openrouter.ai/deepseek/deepseek-v3.2

Their price is not a signal of their costs, it is the result of competitive pressure. This shouldn't be so hard to understand. Companies have burned investor money for market share for quite some time in our world.

This is the expected, the normal, why are you so defensive?

Re: Claude Code is being dumbed down?

#714

Post by yencabulator »

troupo wrote: post #646
bombela wrote: post #488

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Just tell people to install a fast terminal if they somehow happen to have a slow one? Heck, simply handle the scrolling yourself a la tmux/screen and only update the output at most every 4ms? It's so trivial, can't you ask your fancy LLM to do it for you? Or you guys lost the plot at his point and forgot the most basics of writing non pessimized code.

> It's so trivial, can't you ask your fancy LLM to do it for you? They did. And the result was a React render loop that takes 16ms to output a hundred characters to screen and tells them it will take a year to rewrite: https://x.com/trq212/status/2014051501786931427

What's extra funny is that curses diffs a virtual "current screen" to "new screen" to produce the control codes that are used to update the display. Ancient VDOM technology, and plenty fast enough.

Re: Claude Code is being dumbed down?

#715

Post by ivan_gammel »

btown wrote: post #710
ivan_gammel wrote: post #680

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can call it “output granularity” and allow Java logger style configuration, e.g. allowing certain operations to be very verbose while others being simply aggregated

If we're going there, we need to make the logging dynamically configurable with Log4J-style JNDI and LDAP. It's entirely secure as history has shown - and no matter what, it'll still be more secure than installing OpenClaw! (Kidding aside, logging complexity is a slippery slope, and I think it's important, perhaps even at a societal level, for an organization like Anthropic to default to a posture that allows people…

They don’t have to reproduce it literally. It’s an UX problem with many solutions. My point is, you cannot settle on some „average“ solution here. It’s likely that some agents, some operations will be more trustworthy, some less, but that will be highly dependent on context of the execution.

Re: Claude Code is being dumbed down?

#716

Post by jatora »

Grimblewald wrote: post #668
jatora wrote: post #663

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What academic domains are you on the cutting edge of? Genuinely curious what specifically is beyond claude's capabilites

Most recent problems were related to topology, but it can take the wrong direction on many things. This is not an LLM fault; it's a training data issue. If historically a given direction of inquiry is favored, you can't fault an LLM for being biased toward it. However, if small volume and recent results indicate that path is a dead end, you don't want to be stuck in fruitless loops that prevent you from exploring oth…

ahh that makes sense. very interesting thank you!

Re: Claude Code is being dumbed down?

#717

Post by sincerely »

munksbeer wrote: post #691
bostonvaulter2 wrote: post #504

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Another thing: is it possible to turn off the words like finagling and similar (I can't remember the spelling of any of them) ? Big +1 on that. I find the names needlessly distracting. I want to just always say a single thing like “thinking”

> I want to just always say a single thing like “thinking” As a counterview, I like the whimsical verbs. I'll be sticking with them. But nice to see there is an option.

I don't want my tools to make jokes, I want them to work.

Re: Claude Code is being dumbed down?

#718

Post by jtrn »

grim_io wrote: post #657
jtrn wrote: post #653

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I know you think that's a clever comeback, but it's not; it's just a shift in what level of analysis one does. It's an experienced reality indeed, but THEN you create a narrative based on that. Obviously. Experienced reality is, by definition, subjective and affected by filters for what you can, and how, experience things. For instance, you can actually and truly experience something as bad, and then create a narrati…

I'm not sure what you are trying to say. Sometimes people are right about something and sometimes the are not? That's all I got out of it.

No. What you say is obviously true. My question is: Why do, on average, people always make wrong claims in the same DIRECTION? Towards negativity.

Let's say we had objective data on things people say that we know are wrong regarding LLMs. The amount of people who WRONGLY say "It's getting worse" dwarfs the amount of people who WRONGLY think it has gotten better.

All I said is that I'm starting to get more interested in the psychological factors for this observation, the negativity bias, than actually investigating if the latest in a series of "OMG MODEL DEGRADATION" or "UI SUCKS NOW" posts; is actually true.

Re: Claude Code is being dumbed down?

#719

Post by johndough »

elzbardico wrote: post #713
johndough wrote: post #664

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What do you base your accusations on? Is there a specific number from the link above that you claim is a lie? And how are 7 other providers able to offer DeepSeek API access at roughly the same price as DeepSeek? https://openrouter.ai/deepseek/deepseek-v3.2

Their price is not a signal of their costs, it is the result of competitive pressure. This shouldn't be so hard to understand. Companies have burned investor money for market share for quite some time in our world. This is the expected, the normal, why are you so defensive?

> why are you so defensive?

Because you made stuff up, did not show any proof, and ignored my proof to the contrary.

You made the claim:

    > Deepseek lies about costs systematically.
DeepSeek broke down their cost in great detail, yet you simply called it "lies", but did not even mention which specific number of theirs you claim is a lie, so your statement is difficult to falsify. You also ignored my request for clarification.

Re: Claude Code is being dumbed down?

#720

Post by subscribed »

deaux wrote: post #545
lgessler wrote: post #535

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Let's be real here, regardless of what Boris thinks, this decision is not in his hands.

Would love to hear what Boris thinks.

It's been three days. I think he only meant to keep the feedback coming, but not necessarily engaging with the key issues reported.
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