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EU approves legislation to regulate Apple, Google, Meta, and other tech firms

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Re: EU approves legislation to regulate Apple, Google, Meta, and other tech firms

#711

Post by shuckles »

emn13 wrote: post #551
shuckles wrote: post #527

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is only a criticism if you enumerate the deficiencies with the rules you believe are only justified by self-interest.

The linked article lists a bunch of those. Most of that bullet-point list of required or conversely prohibited behaviors apply to Apple. And all of those are justified only by self-interest. Incidentally, that doesn't mean the alternative has to be the wild west - that's a false dichotomy. Controlling access is fine; it's simply not fine that it's the platform that holds exclusive sway, especially if the answer is "o…

This thread is about Apple’s privacy rules for App Store developers, and it’s not plainly obvious which items in the EU proposal enhance those protections at all, but the person I was responding to was insinuating that those protections have self-serving flaws.

Re: EU approves legislation to regulate Apple, Google, Meta, and other tech firms

#712

Post by tjmc »

bzxcvbn wrote: post #475
kmlx wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

depends on the company really. some might think a bit more about offering their products to eu countries considering (some of) these rules. which imo are quite serious, and some even ridiculous.

That's pretty much the point of the regulation. If you're okay with being preyed upon by billion-dollar companies, stay in the US. If you'd like to be protected as a customer, come to the EU. Besides, the DMA has specific exemptions for small companies. Once a company reaches the "gatekeeper" level, they will have had all the necessary time to figure out how to comply with the law.

Oh please. Are any of these billion-dollar companies going to deliberately issue malware that allows them to record my passwords and empty my bank account? Side-loading will be a huge gift for scammers.

Re: EU approves legislation to regulate Apple, Google, Meta, and other tech firms

#713

Post by MatthiasPortzel »

tsimionescu wrote: post #468
joshstrange wrote: post #238

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Happy that I might be able to install something else than Safari. I hope you like Chrome then. > I want the Gecko engine on iOS. It will probably exist in some official capacity (not just the open source wrappers like IceWeasel or whatever they call it) but it will probably get about as much love as it does on Android which is to say not much at all. Also the market share will be <1% if I had to guess which means n…

As a happy exclusive user of Firefox on Android (and PC), I have yet to meet any sites except legacy corporate apps that had any sort of problem with FF in the last 1-2 years at least.

OpenAI’s Playground page mis-rendered for me on FireFox earlier today. I switched to Firefox a week ago.

Re: EU approves legislation to regulate Apple, Google, Meta, and other tech firms

#714

Post by stale2002 »

KerrAvon wrote: post #698
pavlov wrote: post #533

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because it will be a benefit to consumers? The EU has the authority to create new regulations, it’s not limited to antitrust.

It will not be a benefit to consumers. If I have a choice of an Android phone or an Android-like phone with an Apple logo on it, I don’t have a real choice.

Sure you do have a real choice.

Simply only use the Apple app store and you will have the same phone you had before.

Re: EU approves legislation to regulate Apple, Google, Meta, and other tech firms

#715

Post by [deleted] »

izacus wrote: post #130
ajaimk wrote: post #117

Earlier quoted context omitted.

While I want this to be true, consoles only exist because of game revenue. Not sure a $2000 PS5 is as appealing

All new consoles are sold with profit or breaking even so I don't know where this assertion even comes from. Not to mention that they happily double dip by taxing for games, charging online service subscriptions and getting extra revenue via online stores.

[deleted]

Re: EU approves legislation to regulate Apple, Google, Meta, and other tech firms

#716

Post by wtetzner »

threeseed wrote: post #495
Hamuko wrote: post #126

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The PS5 hardware is already profitable (well, the more expensive one at least). Well, it was before the inflation ramped up at least. But still, even if sideloading was possible on the PS5, PlayStation Store revenue would not dip down to nothingness. https://www.digitaltrends.com/gaming/ps5-turning-profit-sony...

But Playstation Store revenue would be decimated by piracy. This isn't conjecture we know for a fact it will happen as we see on PCs.

> This isn't conjecture we know for a fact it will happen as we see on PCs.

Steam seems to be pretty profitable…

Re: EU approves legislation to regulate Apple, Google, Meta, and other tech firms

#717

Post by cafxx »

martimarkov wrote: post #467
DavideNL wrote: post #300

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Apps will use near-field communication technology and other mechanisms to track us So, then do not allow any apps the NFC permission... problem solved. The point is, Apple should not be the one dictating what users can and can not use; Example: on macOS you can disable SIP. 99% of the people i know do not even know what SIP is, nor that this possibility exists. However, if we/Developers/researchers/etc. want it, th…

The main problem is that users can be tricked to do it. Used to happen to my parents all the time on Android. They'd install random apps and the website will "guide" them how to install this app by going to settings and enabling "untrusted developers". This is my issue with all these devs screaming at apple. Your customers chose a product for whatever reason. Don't like it? I don't care - respect their choices. It sp…

Not sure I buy the argument.

By that logic, Apple should only allow phone calls from callers they consider trusted, because any call originating from a non-trusted phone number may be a scam phone call, and someone may fall for it.

Do scam phone call exists? Yes. Do people fall for it? Yes. Does apple block all untrusted phone calls, with no opt-out, as a result of this? (AFAIK) No.

(I could also make the same or similar arguments for web pages, music, podcasts, books, movies, or even apps on their other OS and so on... but phone calls seemed the simplest one to present succinctly.)

Re: EU approves legislation to regulate Apple, Google, Meta, and other tech firms

#718

Post by GlitchMr »

dwaite wrote: post #451
GlitchMr wrote: post #299

Earlier quoted context omitted.

- Web browsers with ad-blocking and plug-ins (Apple currently requires all web browsers to use system Webkit with very limited APIs). - Game cloud streaming services (xCloud, Stadia, GeForce Now). - Unofficial clients for websites such as YouTube that add features that official client doesn't have. - Tools to disable advertisements in applications. - Programs licensed under GPL as Apple App Store bans those.

> Unofficial clients for websites such as YouTube that add features that official client doesn't have. I'm sure Google can send a cease-and-desist to all sorts of other stores instead of just Apple. > Tools to disable advertisements in applications. This would be breaking the sandbox model of the system, I don't think the regulation requires dismantling system security > Programs licensed under GPL as Apple App Store…

> I'm sure Google can send a cease-and-desist to all sorts of other stores instead of just Apple.

Google may dislike those applications and refuse to host them on Google Play, but they aren't doing anything illegal, so they cannot do anything about programs like https://f-droid.org/en/packages/org.schabi.newpipe/ on other stores.

> This would be breaking the sandbox model of the system, I don't think the regulation requires dismantling system security

I don't think it is breaking the sandbox, it could be implemented using NEAppProxyProvider, however this particular API is not available for App Store applications.

> Programs licensed under GPL as Apple App Store bans those.

iPhone version of VLC is licensed under MPL2 specifically for that reason. WebKit is LGPL2.1.

Re: EU approves legislation to regulate Apple, Google, Meta, and other tech firms

#719

Post by MatthiasPortzel »

depressedpanda wrote: post #400
the_duke wrote: post #244

This regulation is 5+ years overdue, but legislation always lags behind market conditions. If the US/other countries follow suit there will probably be a big unintended effect though: the diminishing of open web standards and Google getting final say about what will work on "the web" and what won't. With Firefox diminishing, Safari is the last bastion against a Chromium-only web. There are lots of Chromium forks, but…

What I see, as a web dev, is that finally Apple will have to keep Safari/iOS up-to-date with Safari/macOS, and that in turn up-to-date with all other browsers. I.e., they will no longer be able to artificially hamstring the web in order to prevent web apps from competing with their App Store. They certainly have the money to keep pace with Chrome, and I certainly don't want to put up banners saying "works best in [an…

“They certainly have the money to keep pace with Chrome”

This point has been made before. But Chrome is a moving target. I actually am skeptical that Apple can spend more money on WebKit than Google can on Blink.

The way Chrome rose to prominence was by implement brand-new web standards faster than anyone else. If the question is only, “what engine supports the most websites,” I suspect Chrome will increase their development pace in order to try to extend their lead.

Re: EU approves legislation to regulate Apple, Google, Meta, and other tech firms

#720

Post by samatman »

ayntkilove wrote: post #697
samatman wrote: post #656

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The entire iOS operating system works that way now. I dislike it. I think buttons should be buttons. But this isn't a special case, so unless you consider every instance of two buttons looking this way a dark pattern, this one isn't either.

Personally I find it subconsciously mirrors how we interact with classic HTML. A button posts, a link gets. As a step in the device setup, the button infers some form of enablement or configuration while a link is perfect for skipping.

That's a reasonable perspective that I hadn't considered, and probably makes even more sense to people who barely used/use desktops in the first place.

I still don't like it! But I also never had any trouble using it. Except Apple Music. Don't get me started.

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