We Don't Have a Talent Shortage. We Have a Sucker Shortage • Hacker News Board

Re: We Don't Have a Talent Shortage. We Have a Sucker Shortage

#711

Post by wolfgke » Sun, Apr 21, 2019, 10:45 AM UTC

repler wrote: post #472

wolfgke wrote: post #398

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I ask candidates to tell me about something they created they are proud of, and why. Never be proud of anything that you created - since it probably is not of "top of the world quality". Even in the rare case that it is - it is very likely that even "top of the world" can still be improved.

No offense, but that's pretty sad. I hope you find more rewarding work before you retire. We're only on this Earth once.

I love my current work (in research). But it is nothing that I would ever claim to be proud of. Doing work on top of the world level is not something to be proud of, but a minimum qualification to be even suitable for research.

Re: We Don't Have a Talent Shortage. We Have a Sucker Shortage

#712

Post by TheLuddite » Sun, Apr 21, 2019, 11:04 AM UTC

badpun wrote: post #696

ranci wrote: post #357

Earlier quoted context omitted.

how in the hell would you "never detect a poor performer"? It's one of the most obvious things about the workplace if it is going on.

Colleagues can usually tell, tech lead less so, and manager is often clueless. Basically the only way to judge someone’s output is to work alongside him for a couple months, and only a few colleagues in the team do that. Maybe methodically reviewing someone’s commits every 6 months or so would also work, but that ignores one’s input into decision making, help and mentoring of colleagues etc.

And what will happen if they do a bad work at this? Someone is going to die? No. Someones useless iPhone app will collapse on them? No.

Re: We Don't Have a Talent Shortage. We Have a Sucker Shortage

#713

Post by StavrosK » Sun, Apr 21, 2019, 11:10 AM UTC

nsgf wrote: post #646

StavrosK wrote: post #595

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not the GP, but I make 10k a month, 15 years experience, Python/Django stack, 4 days a week 8 hours a day, no staying late at all necessary, I usually stitch libraries together, although solving complex problems all day long would be better. I hope that helps!

10k p/m in Greece?

Yes, I work for a SV company.

Re: We Don't Have a Talent Shortage. We Have a Sucker Shortage

#714

Post by caprese » Sun, Apr 21, 2019, 11:11 AM UTC

mooreds wrote: post #385

caprese wrote: post #206

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Great! Have you encountered any abuse of the compensation aspect? I typically want to see how people use resources and deliver with real IDEs and collaborative tools like git

I'm not sure what kind of abuse of the compensation you are thinking of? I agree that the most valuable thing is not seeing how the solution was implemented (we want to keep the total hours expended to less than 20 for the senior engineer challenge and less than 5 for the junior challenge) but seeing how someone navigates their environment and how they talk through how they arrived at the solution. It's especially in…

Like too many unqualified candidates trying for it?

Candidates arguing about the amount?

Comp for a take home interview assignment isnt common yet so the social more doesnt exist.

Re: We Don't Have a Talent Shortage. We Have a Sucker Shortage

#715

Post by cannonedhamster » Sun, Apr 21, 2019, 11:15 AM UTC

marcinzm wrote: post #207

owldimoon wrote: post #168

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hey, uh. So, I'm going to be graduating with a B.Eng soon. Any tips on how to realize my own worth? I have a tendency to let myself be taken advantage of... I mean, I'm currently doing a research internship at a computer vision lab at my uni for very little compensation (grant + departmental top-up). I told myself I was doing it "for the experience." I... I feel like I might be a candidate for the behavior you descri…

The best way is to interview at good companies and get offers from them. That means the usual Google, Facebook, Apple, etc. and also up-and-coming ones (Uber, Lyft, etc.). You don't even need to want to work for the company but getting an offer will tell you your worth for the future. You will need to study hard for those interviews but it's well documented online what you need to study specifically (read Cracking th…

Equity is literally a scam at this point because there's the stock options that they give you, the private stock they give themselves, and the stock the VCs get. You're literally last on the list to get paid and first on the list to get shafted. It's not like it used to be where stock meant everyone shared risk and reward.

Re: We Don't Have a Talent Shortage. We Have a Sucker Shortage

#716

Post by 0815test » Sun, Apr 21, 2019, 11:22 AM UTC

cannonedhamster wrote: post #715

marcinzm wrote: post #207

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The best way is to interview at good companies and get offers from them. That means the usual Google, Facebook, Apple, etc. and also up-and-coming ones (Uber, Lyft, etc.). You don't even need to want to work for the company but getting an offer will tell you your worth for the future. You will need to study hard for those interviews but it's well documented online what you need to study specifically (read Cracking th…

Equity is literally a scam at this point because there's the stock options that they give you, the private stock they give themselves, and the stock the VCs get. You're literally last on the list to get paid and first on the list to get shafted. It's not like it used to be where stock meant everyone shared risk and reward.

> You're literally last on the list to get paid and first on the list to get shafted

Isn't that a given with equity? You're literally saying that you're a residual claimant in the enterprise. Yes, with stock options and such things you might be even "more" residual than others in the capital structure, but it's not a "scam".

Re: We Don't Have a Talent Shortage. We Have a Sucker Shortage

#717

Post by cannonedhamster » Sun, Apr 21, 2019, 11:24 AM UTC

duxup wrote: post #538

samhh wrote: post #420

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I was put in touch with a business by a recruiter. I stated my salary expectations, received the typical "that's a little high..." from the recruiter; as per usual, the offers I received justified my stance. They offered me 15% below what I wanted alongside a very uninspiring business in advertising. I was honest and said I was interviewing elsewhere and wasn't about to accept that offer quickly, though it wasn't off…

5k... and god knows how much lost productivity. That's just penny wise and pound foolish... but also IMO a bad sign if that is how they make decisions. After the housing bubble burst I decided it was time to buy a new house. I made an offer on a house and we went back and forth but we hit the ceiling I was willing to pay so we went our separate ways. After the seller had an agreement with two other families fall thro…

Hell, I've literally asked for a non-pay title increase and been shot down before. I was doing significantly more than the job description and literally doubled my salary at the next place. I was not paid well and didn't realize my worth. Now I'm on the other end and despite 3 people accepting offers they all back out on the hire date for a reason no one seems to want to share. There's things I can fix, things I can't fix, and things I just plain don't know about.

Re: We Don't Have a Talent Shortage. We Have a Sucker Shortage

#718

Post by stale2002 » Sun, Apr 21, 2019, 11:38 AM UTC

WalterBright wrote: post #706

stale2002 wrote: post #703

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The more an employer has to guess, the more risk there is in hiring someone. An employees current salary is only barely correlated with a employees skill. They have a multitude of other, much much better factors that they can use to determine if someone is a "risk" or not. > Also, if you wind up getting a salary that's more than you produce for the company You are describing something that is close to impossible to…

> I can just lie about my current salary, and easily get away with, as I have done so multiple times in the past, as well as has many other people that I know. You're not fooling employers, they likely know you and your friends are lying, and discount the offer accordingly. Try bringing a paystub next time, your prospective employer will appreciate it. It's worked out well for me. There have been some high profile ca…

> You're not fooling employers, they likely know you and your friends are lying, and discount the offer accordingly.

It's worked out pretty damn well for me and my friends, actually. I've gotten multiple 25% raises, each time by doing that. (Along with a healthy dose of job hopping)

> were discovered to have lied on their resume

I've never lied on my resume. Only about salaries, while talking to someone in negotiations.

That's just how the negotiation games goes. The employer makes blatant lies all the time in negotiations, also.

For the record, I've gone from a starting salary of 100k, when I just got out of college 6 years ago, to where I am today, which is 270k total comp, at a big 5 tech company.

I am pretty happy with those results. Especially so, because I've only ever considered myself to be an average engineer.

Or are you going to try and flatter me by saying that I could have been doing even better than going from 100k to 270k in 6 years? Perhaps. But I'd hardly say that I haven't done alright for myself.

Re: We Don't Have a Talent Shortage. We Have a Sucker Shortage

#719

Post by dannypgh » Sun, Apr 21, 2019, 12:16 PM UTC

CapricornNoble wrote: post #438

dannypgh wrote: post #345

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I would imagine the federal government has enough transparency and process regarding pay scales to make this moot.

Lemme clarify: your application FOR a Federal position is expected to include your PREVIOUS salaries, regardless of whether they were public or private sector. So if you are a California resident and you submit an application for a Federal position in California, but you don't disclose your previous salaries, I wonder if they consider your application incomplete? If that was used as justification for rejecting your a…

I'm saying, the reason the restriction is present on private employers is so they don't make a low offer to someone who had been paid less before.

My understanding of federal employment is that the pay scales are published and public record, and job postings state which scale it's on. This level of disclosure seems to minimize the possible harm here, as there's far less room for negotiation for anyone.

Re: We Don't Have a Talent Shortage. We Have a Sucker Shortage

#720

Post by le-mark » Sun, Apr 21, 2019, 12:43 PM UTC

marktangotango wrote: post #498

antoinevg wrote: post #260

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is a difference between promising a unicorn and having a proven track record. That you are too lazy to verify the background your potential hire is providing you is 100% your problem. Bite me.

How would that background verification work exactly? Your groomed references are providing objective evaluations? Bite you indeed.

Back channels would be one way, but then how to verify the back channel? Sibling "I know and your dumb" response not very illuminating here.