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Mac mini will be made at a new facility in Houston

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Re: Mac mini will be made at a new facility in Houston

#701

Post by fragmede »

palmotea wrote: post #580
fragmede wrote: post #515

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You don't have to work 996 to have an attitude of let's help the customer take their product to market. The American machine shop will laugh at you for not being a machinist, and tell you oh we don't do powder coating, we don't make cardboard boxes or styrofoam inserts. So then you, as the customer trying to get a product to market gotta run around town figuring it all out. Meanwhile, you start talking to the Chinese…

So basically you're blaming American workers for an attitude problem, when the real issue is, due to offshoring, the supply chain either doesn't exist here or isn't so centralized/expansive enough that someone has random relatives in related manufacturing businesses they're motivated to send work to? So basically, you're being unfair. And, from personal experience, while it's not exactly the same, when I've worked wi…

[dead]

Re: Mac mini will be made at a new facility in Houston

#702

Post by fragmede »

Loughla wrote: post #586
fragmede wrote: post #515

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You don't have to work 996 to have an attitude of let's help the customer take their product to market. The American machine shop will laugh at you for not being a machinist, and tell you oh we don't do powder coating, we don't make cardboard boxes or styrofoam inserts. So then you, as the customer trying to get a product to market gotta run around town figuring it all out. Meanwhile, you start talking to the Chinese…

So your argument is that because machine shops don't do the leg work for you in finding suppliers for the things you need, they're worse?

Yes. It's a fundamental attitude problem of "that's not my job, it's your problem". It's like after your car gets into a crash. You just want your car back the way it was before the crash, assuming you don't take the insurance pay out. You want to be taken care of. But no, you gotta take it to a mechanic, then a body shop, and then a glass place. Or for software "well, it works on my machine". Even if we take the attitude out of the picture, if you're operating a business, you don't have time to spare. Having to find vendors for each step of the process takes time that could be better spent working on the product.

Re: Mac mini will be made at a new facility in Houston

#703

Post by GreenWatermelon »

viraptor wrote: post #390
hamandcheese wrote: post #355

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> If there was really true 'progress', then you wouldn't need a one-party system that suppresses all dissent. This makes no sense. It is possible for a totalitarian government which is threatened by dissent and concepts like "democracy" to also work in the interest of improving overall quality of life.

If things work so well that everyone's quality or life is improved, why would there be dissent large enough to worry about. It's the same category as: Why would a company with happy well paid workers be worried about unions and try to stop them forming.

Foreign state-actors love to sow discontent in enemy territories. It doesn't matter what they say to rile up the population and cause instability -- they'll just do it.

Re: Mac mini will be made at a new facility in Houston

#705

Post by Haven880 »

pear01 wrote: post #314
SaltyBackendGuy wrote: post #261

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This reminds me of a great freakonomics podcast that talked about China being run by engineers and America being run by lawyers. https://freakonomics.com/podcast/china-is-run-by-engineers-a...

That guy is so annoying his subpar analysis has become such a trope. America used to build things too. Lawyers have been part of the founding and fabric of both societies. Trying to reduce China v America to engineers vs lawyers is so reductive it's just mind blowing this keeps getting repeated.

You probably havnt been to Shenzhen yet. Try visit there once. You will change the text you typed here.

Re: Mac mini will be made at a new facility in Houston

#706

Post by Loughla »

fragmede wrote: post #702
Loughla wrote: post #586

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So your argument is that because machine shops don't do the leg work for you in finding suppliers for the things you need, they're worse?

Yes. It's a fundamental attitude problem of "that's not my job, it's your problem". It's like after your car gets into a crash. You just want your car back the way it was before the crash, assuming you don't take the insurance pay out. You want to be taken care of. But no, you gotta take it to a mechanic, then a body shop, and then a glass place. Or for software "well, it works on my machine". Even if we take the att…

First off, if you have a car accident and one shop doesn't do everything to fix it, you went to a terrible shop. I've never seen a body repair shop that didn't do all that.

But that's beside the point.

Do you honestly expect a machine shop, a place that specializes in creating or fixing or modifying pieces of metal, to find you packaging and fluff for inside the package and then ship it to your customers? Why?

I'm absolutely confused on why you would expect a company that has literally nothing to do with an area of business to just do that thing for you for your convenience.

Do you expect your plumber to also put your floors down? Do you expect your doctor to also clean your teeth or do your taxes?

This isn't an 'attitude problem', this is a 'you have irrational expectations' problem.

Re: Mac mini will be made at a new facility in Houston

#707

Post by lenerdenator »

kube-system wrote: post #660
_DeadFred_ wrote: post #652

Earlier quoted context omitted.

China didn't either, until it did. US business isn't willing to build up the workforce to do this but we definitely have the people.

The US used to have a more built out industrial base but since those days a lot of things have changed, structurally, economically, culturally, and in their regulatory environment. The people who would have been doing this work are doing cushy service industry jobs today.

If there's one thing that places like Gary, Indiana and Flint, Michigan are known for, it's their cushy service industry jobs.

Re: Mac mini will be made at a new facility in Houston

#709

Post by manuelabeledo »

maxdo wrote: post #696
manuelabeledo wrote: post #680

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> You can’t be a successful country full of lawyers and doctors only. You have to actually build something The GDP sector composition of most of the largest economies is heavily service biased. So, no.

Gambia has 70% of service economy. Do you want USA live like Gambia ? With your logic money grows on the trees. Services inside of the country does not produce anything. US doctors able to buy Mercedes cars from Germany because this country still exports windows and iPhones.

> Gambia has 70% of service economy. Do you want USA live like Gambia ?

What are you even talking about.

Iraq economy is almost 60% industrial, are they doing better than Ireland? Of course not.

Also, the US is the second largest country by motor vehicle production in the world. And the US GDP is 80% service derived.

Re: Mac mini will be made at a new facility in Houston

#710

Post by kube-system »

lenerdenator wrote: post #707
kube-system wrote: post #660

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The US used to have a more built out industrial base but since those days a lot of things have changed, structurally, economically, culturally, and in their regulatory environment. The people who would have been doing this work are doing cushy service industry jobs today.

If there's one thing that places like Gary, Indiana and Flint, Michigan are known for, it's their cushy service industry jobs.

I'm not sure if you've been following economic and demographic trends over the past 50 years, but people have largely left those places to go elsewhere for work.
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