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The pro-Israel information war

jackpoulson.substack.com

701–710 of 1001 posts

Re: The pro-Israel information war

#701

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's realpolitik. It's not about Israel. It's about Russia and Iran. To a lesser extent it's also about the Suez. It also doesn't hurt that any aid, is defense spending in the US which is a stimulus for jobs or manufacturing for defense. Overall it's cheap expenditure for the US.

> It's realpolitik. It's not about Israel It is not at all. This funding is only occurring because of AIPAC and similar organizations including Christian groups who want to see the end times happen and supporting Israel is apparently important for that. Israel is not a counter balance to Russia at all. And Israel (specifically Netanyahu and AIPAC) undermined the Iran agreement that was going to see them stop their nu…

No, if you read history, Israel had done a ton of stuff to make Europe and America happy.

They invaded the Suez Canal when Egypt tried to nationalize it. They did it for France and Britain.

During the Cold War, they provided of information to the US govt about Soviet assets. They also tell the US information about other countries from their intelligence.

The fact of the matter is Israel’s neighbors hate Israel so they need to get support from whoever they can, so they try to appease Europe and America. America goes along with it because it works out for us. Israel also also economically and technologically in a better spot than a lot of other Middle Eastern countries which are already semi-hostile to America, so they’re one of the better allies to have in that region.

America doesn’t give a damn about Israel anymore than France. It’s the working relationship that keeps it going — for both parties.

The problem right now is that both Israel and Palestine are both run by extreme right wingers. Extremist right wingers are always trying to start wars.

However, US foreign policy generally prefers having a working relationship than caring if a country is democratic or ticking the “is good” boxes. Most countries in the world make terrible allies. They’re weak, or they’re unstable, or every 30 years, their system of government will have completely changed. Despite the shit Israel does, they are consistent and stable, two traits many countries have not figured out.

Re: The pro-Israel information war

#703

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Another possible explanation for this skew is that TikTok and IG are primarily video platforms. The videos of destruction and death in Gaza are far more horrific than corresponding videos in Israel, because the scale of what Israel is doing to Gaza is so much greater than what Gaza has done to Israel. Another way of saying it is, it makes sense that someone who spends hours on apps optimized for empathy-based addicti…

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My deepest condolences. Words fail.

Re: The pro-Israel information war

#704

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I don't support how civilians are being treated in Palestine whatsoever, but: >while condemning the massacre of civilians under the orders of Likud (and other far right parties) When has Likud ordered massacres of civilians? Or when has any modern Israeli party? I also don't believe Likud is considered far-right in Israel; just "right". There are parties far to the right of them. Not that that's necessarily a good th…

Here is a long list of Israeli politicians and military officers who have declared their intent to massacre civilians: - Israeli Prime Minister (!!) Benjamin Netanyahu: "You must remember what Amalek has done to you, says our Holy Bible. And we do remember." [1] - IDF spokesman Daniel Hagari: "we're focused on what causes maximum damage" [2] - Israeli defense Minister Yoav Gallant: "I have ordered a complete siege on…

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Re: The pro-Israel information war

#705
post #521

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think the fundamental assumption of the analysis that there are two mutually exclusive groups, 'pro-Israel' and 'pro-Palestine' is flawed. It is possible to simultaneously support the interests of Palestinian and Israeli civilians (and support a peaceful Israel within the 1967 boundaries), while condemning the massacre of civilians under the orders of Likud (and other far right parties) and Hamas. I think it is cur…

I think that forcing this dichotomy is part of the deliberate pro-Israel media strategy - if you despise Hamas inhumane acts, then of course you need to be pro-Israel. They want you to focus on Hamas to steer away your attention from what Israel has been doing. (this is also one of the reasons why Hamas has historically been an asset for the Israeli right)

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Re: The pro-Israel information war

#706

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think that forcing this dichotomy is part of the deliberate pro-Israel media strategy - if you despise Hamas inhumane acts, then of course you need to be pro-Israel. They want you to focus on Hamas to steer away your attention from what Israel has been doing. (this is also one of the reasons why Hamas has historically been an asset for the Israeli right)

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Re: The pro-Israel information war

#707
post #7

Pro-Palestinian views outrank Pro-Israeli online by around 36 to 1 on TikTok and 8 to 1 on other online platforms. https://twitter.com/antgoldbloom/status/1721561226151612602 If anything the skew within the platforms is to prioritize pro-palestinian views https://twitter.com/committeeonccp/status/173279243496103143... It also seems like these platforms create (rather than support) anti-Israeli views: https://twitter.…

Anti-semitism in and of itself is unequivocally wrong. But conflating anti-Israeli views with anti-Semitic views does a disservice to Jews and Palestinians alike.

  > But conflating anti-Israeli views with anti-Semitic views does a disservice to Jews and Palestinians alike.
Anti-Israeli views are anti-Semitic views when criticizing Israel and Israel only, for actions that are done by dozens of states over the course of decades.

If the people spouting anti-Israel sentiment spouted the same sentiment for the same actions done a dozen times over by other nations, then they would not be anti-Semitic. In fact, I would agree with the vast majority of them. But when they ignore the 300,000 killed in Syria, or the 600,000 killed in Ethiopia, or the situations in Yemen, Mail, Turkey, or even Gaza when Hamas murders hundreds of Palestinians, or in Syria where the regime kills thousands of Palestinians, then it is clear that they are not stewards of "human rights" or "civilians" or even "values". Rather, they are abusing these ideas to promote an anti-Semitic agenda. These people actually need dead Palestinians to further their agenda.

Re: The pro-Israel information war

#708
post #700

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If someone's supporters lie enough can you genocide them? If not then I don't see how this is relevant.

This is a discussion about propaganda, not justifying the scale of a military response. As an aside throwing the word "genocide" around lightly is also one of the cheapest forms of discourse. Constantly escalating language doesn't make for useful debate. It's just an overused tactic to make your opinions sound more important.

Claiming that a force currently committing a genocide has "moral clarity" is simultaneously propaganda and a justification of the genocide, yes.

I'm not using it for effect, it's an accurate description according to this israeli scholar of genocides. https://jewishcurrents.org/a-textbook-case-of-genocide

Re: The pro-Israel information war

#709

I have not read this article. I am sad to see it here. I am Jewish and Hacker News has been my one sanctuary from all that has been going on. I feel a dreadful sadness about this whole situation, and unfortunately I have found that any issue I have looked into in any detail descends into a battle of claim and counterclaim. I have had to just give up and let it play out, not only what has happened and what will happen…

I know a lot of Palestinians and they don't have the luxury of avoiding the news because they still have family in Gaza.

Re: The pro-Israel information war

#710
post #7

Pro-Palestinian views outrank Pro-Israeli online by around 36 to 1 on TikTok and 8 to 1 on other online platforms. https://twitter.com/antgoldbloom/status/1721561226151612602 If anything the skew within the platforms is to prioritize pro-palestinian views https://twitter.com/committeeonccp/status/173279243496103143... It also seems like these platforms create (rather than support) anti-Israeli views: https://twitter.…

>US views skew pro-israel, and GenZ is closer to 50/50, so if there's something going on online, it's not in favor of Israel. That could also mean that Israeli online propaganda is ineffective, not that it doesn't exist. Even if they haven't made ground online, pro-Israeli views are universal in the mainstream media, with pro-Palestine reporters being fired.

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