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Senate Bill to Ban TikTok

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Re: Senate Bill to Ban TikTok

#701

Post by ActorNightly »

RoyGBivCap wrote: post #549
ActorNightly wrote: post #286

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Honest question,did the Patriot act ever get misused intentionally in a grossly negligent way?

The TSA violates the 4th amendment millions of times a day. I think that covers both grossly, and negligent. Here's the full text of 4a, see for yourself: >The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by oath or affirmation, and particularly describi…

This just reads like libertarian erotic fanfic. First you write a bad character that is evil at the core, like the TSA, then you write about how it skirts the law knowingly to exact its evil onto the people, and thats by design.

If TSA didn't exist, and airlines were in charge of their own security, every single accident or incident would be blamed on companies trying to raise their profits by cutting costs, and people would be screaming for government to intervene. Just like they are doing currently with Tesla and autopilot.

Also, you don't have to fly if you are going to US. You can drive most places. Flying is using the services of a private company, on their terms, which without TSA would still include TSA like security. If you are going overseas, then it makes sense for security like the TSA because US laws don't apply to other countries.

As an aside, I see more and more reddit-like posts like this on HN - unsubstantiated, baseless wokeposting. Did you guys get tired of your echo chambers on there?

Re: Senate Bill to Ban TikTok

#702

Post by di456 »

kortilla wrote: post #513
di456 wrote: post #503

Yet congress won't do a fucking thing to keep guns away from child killers. Childhood education is one remaining basic social safety net and is more and more at risk with every school massacre. The mental health impact of kids, parents, and teachers having to worry about STAYING THE FUCK ALIVE IN SCHOOL EVERYDAY cannot be understated.

> The mental health impact of kids, parents, and teachers having to worry about STAYING THE FUCK ALIVE IN SCHOOL EVERYDAY cannot be understated. Sounds like a problem with the media then. Ban coverage of shootings if people can’t behave rationally about risks. Children are 1000x more likely to die in a car crash than a school shooting.

My kids' school has had 2 active shooter lockdowns this year alone because of shootings withing a mile or two of the school. One was yesterday. They do this now until the suspect is caught.

My good friend is a teacher in another state. A school near his lost a teacher to gun violence this month. Between gun violence, going thru COVID, and general apathy to learning from his students, he's about done with teaching.

Both turned out fine but this takes a heavy toll on the school community. Kids should be learning and playing. Teachers should be teaching. Parents should be at peace knowing their kids are safe. That used to be a given. It's not anymore.

Guns now kill more kids than vehicle accidents. Sure, not all of those deaths are in schools. But the point still stands.

https://www.cnn.com/2023/03/29/health/us-children-gun-deaths...

We have a massive gun violence problem deep inside of American culture. No other country comes close to our level of gun violence.

Re: Senate Bill to Ban TikTok

#703

Post by throwaway29812 »

sebzim4500 wrote: post #480
throwaway29812 wrote: post #262

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> the same level of sweeping control with the implementation of a Great Firewall The same level ?

Genuine question: can violating the Great Firewall lead to a 20 year prison sentence? What about a $1M fine?

1. Hundreds of bills exist in draft form, like this one, and are never passed.

2. There are countless examples of dissidents in China disappeared that amounts to worse than a 20 year prison sentence, which again is part of a bill that remains highly unlikely to pass in its current form.

I would point to actual cases of authoritarian oppression rather than theoretical ones.

Re: Senate Bill to Ban TikTok

#704

Post by throwaway29812 »

firen777 wrote: post #558
sebzim4500 wrote: post #480

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Genuine question: can violating the Great Firewall lead to a 20 year prison sentence? What about a $1M fine?

If you are small fish watching Twitch and Pornhub, couple of weeks, maybe. If you are a dissidents influencer or online figure, on the other hand, you will be lucky to even be found out why you disappeared.

We still don't know where this woman is: https://www.buzzfeednews.com/article/kassycho/chinese-woman-...

And more recently: https://www.cnn.com/2023/01/22/china/china-zero-covid-protes...

Re: Senate Bill to Ban TikTok

#705

Post by throwaway29812 »

withinboredom wrote: post #424
throwaway29812 wrote: post #384

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anecdote Your experience is not everyones experience. For example, the country you describe has 0% resemblance to the one I know. Why should your experience matter more than mine? Are you actually proposing that your experiences are in some way typical ?

Every American expat I know has a similar-ish process where they have to get over the fear/anxiety from living in the US. It’s a proper dinner topic. So yes, I assume it’s typical. Perhaps not 1:1, but there are always similar elements. Edit to add: everyone says they never noticed it while living there. They only noticed it after the first few months/years when it was no longer present.

> Every American expat I know has a similar-ish process where they have to get over the fear/anxiety from living in the US.

So your selection bias includes only people that have made the decision to leave. Do you not see the issue ?

Even if you didn't select into people who left presumably for a reason, this is still an anecdote. It's your opinion, your reality. It's not shared.

For example, I have an anecdote of living in the EU. It's cloudy 10 months out of the year, everywhere except in the south. No one told me that. Winters were harsh. Foreigners in general were not accepted, most social interactions were with other ex-pats. Salary was much lower and that limited my ability to buy property and save for retirement.

I could go on. But what I wouldn't do is broadcast all of this as if it's some kind of universal truth. It's just my experience.

Re: Senate Bill to Ban TikTok

#706

Post by throwaway29812 »

kelipso wrote: post #484
withinboredom wrote: post #424

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Every American expat I know has a similar-ish process where they have to get over the fear/anxiety from living in the US. It’s a proper dinner topic. So yes, I assume it’s typical. Perhaps not 1:1, but there are always similar elements. Edit to add: everyone says they never noticed it while living there. They only noticed it after the first few months/years when it was no longer present.

I have experienced this every time I go out if the country for two weeks and come back. Main thing I notice is the fear I sense in people whenever cops are nearby, and definitely the sense of this security state hovering over everyone. The feeling of personal freedom I have feels like it gets wrenched away whenever I enter the US. The talk of freedom in America is basically cope for having no personal freedom. Wherev…

> Main thing I notice is the fear I sense in people whenever cops are nearby, and definitely the sense of this security state hovering over everyone.

As someone that has lived in a police state before, I can't tell you that your feelings in the US aren't valid. They are yours alone. But perhaps travel somewhere were actual security forces search you randomly, harass you for no reason, etc. Experiences I have never had in the US, not once.

Re: Senate Bill to Ban TikTok

#707

Post by [deleted] »

ironick09 wrote: post #599
withinboredom wrote: post #424

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Every American expat I know has a similar-ish process where they have to get over the fear/anxiety from living in the US. It’s a proper dinner topic. So yes, I assume it’s typical. Perhaps not 1:1, but there are always similar elements. Edit to add: everyone says they never noticed it while living there. They only noticed it after the first few months/years when it was no longer present.

Honestly this just sounds entirely made up. It seems surreal to me that you live your life in fear, of what? The United States? Either that or you’re extremely over exaggerating.

[deleted]

Re: Senate Bill to Ban TikTok

#708

Post by throwaway29812 »

withinboredom wrote: post #678
stametseater wrote: post #502

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I’ve had cops plant evidence in my car, I’ve been hit by trucks running red lights, I’ve gotten in a knife fight with a hobo, I’ve been shot at on the highway, I’ve been fired for no reason, I’ve gotten in a motorcycle accident that fucked me over seven ways to Sunday. Are you quite sure you're not misremembering an action movie for your own experiences? Living in America is not even remotely this exciting for most…

To be fair, those are the least crazy things I’ve had happen to me or done in my lifetime. I should write a book…

Are you still trying to present these experiences as typical ?

Re: Senate Bill to Ban TikTok

#709

Post by stametseater »

satvikpendem wrote: post #539
stametseater wrote: post #531

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Of course the clear meaning of this paradox is that everybody who disagrees with me is intolerant of me, therefore it is my moral imperative to be intolerant to everybody I oppose. /s Or here's a better idea: The Golden Rule. Eye for an eye is how you run a war, not a civil society.

That doesn't always work so well. If some Viking expedition is coming to pillage your "civil society," for example, there's really not much you can do except to fight. Of course, you can decide who to support or oppose as your moral imperative, but don't be surprised if it has negative consequences to you.

If a war comes to you, then you've got to fight a war and an eye for an eye is the way to do that. But that's no principle on which to organize a civil society.

Re: Senate Bill to Ban TikTok

#710

Post by zappchance »

makeitdouble wrote: post #673
graeme wrote: post #355

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Possibly. But, many countries are formally US allies, with deep security integration. So an American owned application is not as threatening as a Chinese owned application. America also generally allows businesses and media from foreign companies to take part, whereas China has no such reciprocity. Security arrangements are real things that can't be merely handwaved away as something that "should" not exist in one's…

As your former president eloquently explained, "USA first" is the current US doctrine. Why should the other countries accept US influence short of not having the choice as it would have pretty deep repercussions? The game of cutting off foreign players is a luxury only the few countries can afford right now, making it look like everybody else supports the US is disingenuous.

The current age of global peace is wonderful and pleasant. It is also young and fragile. Other countries can choose who they wish to align with, I hope most liberal democracies will find the United States to be a more reliable ally than China or Russia.

The price of association with the US is, as you say, US influence; however, US influence is much less restrictive and oppressive than many other major players today and historically. Our EU allies regularly criticize us in public forums; North Korea does not have the political freedom to criticize China and Belarus does not have the political freedom to criticize Russia to the same extent that United States' allies do today.

It's high time for global players to wake up from the ideal world where everyone can get along with zero tariffs or restrictions. The United States must do what is in her best interests and other states should follow her lead. I believe it is the US best interest that the world is more free, and should that eventual goal require some restriction of hostile foreign entities' freedom to operate on US soil, so be it.

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