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Amazon Go

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Re: Amazon Go

#701

Post by falcolas »

guntars wrote: post #595
CrLf wrote: post #500

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The Earth's population isn't getting any lower, those 10 jobs lost mean 10 people that will need support from the rest of society, just to survive. It's utopian to think job losses mean everybody gets their workload reduced, as this has never happened before. Automation has never reduced anybody's workloads. In fact, every reduction has happened to either eliminate de-facto slaves (industrial revolution) or because e…

They already need the support of the rest of society. No one survives on their own anymore. Automating a job like this gives more time and money back to people who buy groceries, which is almost everyone. Some of that can be used to support the lost jobs while they find something else to do.

> Automating a job like this gives more [...] money back to people who buy groceries

Honestly, I think this is never going to actually be the case. Why would a grocery store lower prices just because their costs went down a bit? Neither the demand nor the supply has changed, nor has the price people are willing to pay for their groceries.

If nothing has changed but your costs, why lower the prices when you can simply report increased revenue to your shareholders? If competition comes along, a quick "we're premium, they are cheap" marketing campaign (or buying them out) would probably cost less than lowering the prices to match.

Re: Amazon Go

#702

Post by duaneb »

baddox wrote: post #694
CrLf wrote: post #450

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I am unsure we are evolving. We have evolved in many areas that solve real problems, like healthcare and such, but I'm not sure today's society is any better for all the technology that allows us to save a couple of minutes in a queue. To improve the efficiency of a particular group, we create problems elsewhere. The result may not be net positive. In fact, I think it isn't, since those saved "couple of minutes" will…

Browsing Facebook sounds like passive social interactions with friends that you've deliberately chosen, rather than passive social interactions with whoever your local grocery store employees happen to be. It doesn't really sound that much worse to me.

That sounds like an echo chamber to me. Hardly healthy for a society, let alone an individual. Such alienation from your neighbors!

Re: Amazon Go

#703

Post by duaneb »

joshumax wrote: post #637
dap wrote: post #515

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The claim that increased automation will enable people not to work is often cited as a defense of putting people out of work in favor of automation. This relies heavily on a number of assumptions that I think are empirically completely untested: - that automating all jobs will cause all prices to go down. (It seems just as plausible that if everything were automated, then the relatively small class of people who work…

Funny how I just finish my Thesis on automation and its effects on globalization and the workforce the day before this comes out...

Is it any good?

Re: Amazon Go

#704

Post by Raphael »

oaktowner wrote: post #215

Interesting that they say "Amazon Go is currently open to Amazon employees in our Beta program, and will open to the public in early 2017." Generally "beta" implies that non-employees are using it. This is more of a dogfooding program (though maybe they wanted to avoid that term since they're selling human food this way!).

closed beta

Re: Amazon Go

#705

Post by mstodd »

delegate wrote: post #387

Look, I know this might not be a popular view here on HN, but I think this is useless. And bad. I'm not talking about the technology behind it (I think it's an amazing achievement).. I live in Barcelona and I have at least 5 medium-sized supermarkets within 5 minutes walking distance from my home. Plus there are several smaller shops that sell fruits and vegetables. I know all the people who work in these supermarket…

Other people don't share your values, nor should they, nor should you expect them to. I would rather have more humans working these jobs, but minimum wage laws prevent that.

There's no reason why your human interaction would suffer if you truly value it. With the money and time saved, perhaps people now go to the cafe and talk more often, or perhaps there's now a vendor outside the shop where you can get a conversation and a coffee. More than likely there will be a solution that i can't even think of.

Re: Amazon Go

#706

Post by TeMPOraL »

davidw wrote: post #496
subdane wrote: post #473

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This makes sense from a suburban, car-based perspective. From a walking, city-based lens, neighborhoods and social interactions make a lot of sense. It's why coffee shops haven't been made obsolete by vending machines - at least here in New York. Point is, it depends on your perspective.

I think it makes sense whatever way you get around. If people value something, by and large, they'll pay for it. Most people want to get their shopping done quickly and efficiently. However, I could easily see niches keeping people around. The first thing that comes to mind is a higher end sort of place where customers want some knowledgeable help in selecting what they're buying. Spend some money on a few people who…

It also depends on the state and stage of one's life. For instance, as a student, I loved chatting up clerks in grocery stores. I actually met my SO this way. Being older and working full time now, I would vastly prefer to never visit any store ever, and buy everything on-line. It's not cheap enough yet though, so that's why today after work I'm visiting the cheapest store around to restock my fridge...

Re: Amazon Go

#707

Post by elicash »

wccrawford wrote: post #692
elicash wrote: post #43

I worked at a grocery store for several years, and one thing I recall is customers CONSTANTLY putting items back in a random aisle, rather than where they found it. I wonder how this tech deals with that? Maybe they figured that out, too. But I was amused in the video when I saw the customer putting it back where it belonged, because that's not how I remember that going... All that said, this is fantastic and excitin…

I'm assuming that the position on the shelf has very little to do with adding the item to the cart. I'm guessing that taking the item out of range of a scanner and into range of your phone is what does it. I've not seen anyone so far suggest that people will still work at the store. There will still be people who help customers do what they need, but instead of mindlessly scanning groceries, they'll be there for the…

If that's the case, that this is a solved problem, they should have showed that off!

Re: Amazon Go

#708

Post by csomar »

kcorbitt wrote: post #503
csomar wrote: post #425

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, I can see lots of issues here. Maybe you are being isolated from what is going on here. These guys might have been ordered by management to smile for customers. That doesn't make them happy. Just a bit more miserable, but you don't see any of it. I can't see why anybody will like to finish their life counting stuff and money for other people. I can hardly see them happy even if they smile to me. And here is ano…

(What follows are generalizations that of course have exceptions.) For the record, this is likely less true in Barcelona than in most parts of the US. While a supermarket cashier isn't seen as a good job in Spain, people also care much, much less about having a "good" job, and much more about their quality of life outside of work. Also contributing to this is the fact that the difference in social respect and overall…

I'm not talking about salary or social status. I'm talking about doing the actual job. There is nothing full-filing in a routine, very basic job (scanning items back and forth). A plumber is more interesting in this regard.

Another useless job: A door-man.

Re: Amazon Go

#709

Post by biztos »

crazypyro wrote: post #429
delegate wrote: post #387

Look, I know this might not be a popular view here on HN, but I think this is useless. And bad. I'm not talking about the technology behind it (I think it's an amazing achievement).. I live in Barcelona and I have at least 5 medium-sized supermarkets within 5 minutes walking distance from my home. Plus there are several smaller shops that sell fruits and vegetables. I know all the people who work in these supermarket…

Trying to save jobs that are no longer the most efficient way of solving a problem is not the way to promote the value of humanity, in my opinion. People want groceries as cheap and fast as possible. They don't go to the grocery store for social interaction and forcing the majority of people to pay extra for something that only the minority get value out of is not a competitive strategy. If humanity were to take your…

This comment makes me suspect you may have never been to a farmer's market, or a market hall (of which Barcelona has some of the world's most glorious examples).

While it's possible that some people "want groceries as cheap and fast as possible," I don't think either of those is true of the hundreds of people I join at my local market every week.

I go there mainly because I like buying directly from the producers. I want there to be independent farmers in the future too, for reasons of taste, culture, ecology, and food safety.

But I also enjoy my interactions with some of the sellers. Some people probably go mainly for that reason. The market is full, despite a big ugly multinational supermarket 100m away that has cheaper (and worse) versions of just about everything on offer. That supermarket is also full, though I think the reasons why are not as simple as market efficiency.

A lot of us will continue to share the parent poster's opinion, and hopefully in sufficient numbers to keep all the little bodegas going. Because we care about food, and we care about living among humans.

Re: Amazon Go

#710

Post by nileshtrivedi »

BorisMelnik wrote: post #688
crazypyro wrote: post #429

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Trying to save jobs that are no longer the most efficient way of solving a problem is not the way to promote the value of humanity, in my opinion. People want groceries as cheap and fast as possible. They don't go to the grocery store for social interaction and forcing the majority of people to pay extra for something that only the minority get value out of is not a competitive strategy. If humanity were to take your…

Have you considered that life isn't all about efficiency? People shop because of the experience. This is why book stores are coming "back," eBooks just aren't cutting it for people. This is why "smart lights" won't ever truly take off, people don't want to log onto an app to turn their lights off.

If people really shop "because of the experience", then this technology is nothing to worry about as it will fail in the market.
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