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Google got it wrong. The open-office trend is destroying the workplace

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Re: Google got it wrong. The open-office trend is destroying the workplace

#71

Post by moe »

stevesearer wrote: post #39
fsloth wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Open offices lets me be around my colleagues and inspires me to focus on my work and get access to help promptly when I need it. " Actually any co-location scheme allows this, walls or no walls. It's a matter of culture, not of vertical dividers. But I concur, it's a bit over the top to say that "everyone" hates open offices since clearly some people don't. Personally, to me it feels like a quarter suffers, of which…

I run an office design website and I hardly ever see team rooms, which is very surprising and they seem like a good balance between collaborative space and privacy. One of the offices I like to show as an example is Ubiquiti Networks, particularly images 3 and 4 (pardon the link to my own website): http://officesnapshots.com/2014/03/12/ubiquiti-networks-san-...

Sorry, but to me that office has the charme of a morgue.

The choice of materials and colors (metal, stone, glass and black) feels more suited to a parking garage than an office.

Also glass walls do not help with visual distractions. They can in fact make them worse due to reflections.

Re: Google got it wrong. The open-office trend is destroying the workplace

#72

Post by simonsarris »

I imagine when google interviews candidates they don't do it in the open office, they probably go into a (quiet) conference room.

That's at least a little telling, isn't it?

Suggestion: Request to be interviewed in the actual seat/location that you're going to be working in and see what they say.

Re: Google got it wrong. The open-office trend is destroying the workplace

#73

Post by Apocryphon »

gnaritas wrote: post #64
magicalist wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Given the popularity of site-blocking apps like SelfControl, Freedom etc, yes, many people do need help with this. I don't use them, but I go through quite wide swings between ignoring many distractions to get work done to having trouble getting work done because of all the distractions (just plotting my HN comments alone would probably yield a nice sinusoidal wave). And I absolutely use a choice of work space to hel…

If the work can't keep your attention, perhaps you should find better work.

This is an age-old problem.

* In a survey of more than 3,200 people conducted by Salary.com, 64% say they visit websites unrelated to work daily.

Source: http://business.time.com/2012/03/13/youre-wasting-time-at-wo...

Re: Google got it wrong. The open-office trend is destroying the workplace

#74

Post by jfoutz »

dillon wrote: post #22

I think this has been a discussion going on for a long time now. What I believe to be true is it really depends on the person. If you're someone who is self-conscious then yes you'll feel like everyone is judging you all the time. If you have the ability to stay focused on your work without being around colleagues then you should be allowed to work from home. I've worked in open offices, offices with high partitions…

I think you're much more self aware about how you solve problems than i am. Most problems are just exploring a configuration space. Stuff like using a hashtable instead of a set, because there's extra associated information, or traversing a datastructure in a different order. Perhaps complex, but ultimately understandable changes.

Sometimes though, the impossible happens. Maybe a race condition or something. In those cases i find myself questioning my mental model, which is good. It leads me compare what i think is happening to what is actually happening. If i don't find that mismatch, my mind sort of tenses up.

Those terrible problems lead me to question my understanding of reality and my self worth. Some things are just hard. I really do just check out and play video games for a while. Something in my mind relaxes, my subconscious chews on the problem for a while. Sometimes i have to sleep before I feel like i can continue.

When i'm working near my limits, i get weird. I know other poeple who just grit their teeth and go on. I've tried that, but it feels like the road to burnout for me. I know others deal with that well.

Talking sometimes helps, but because my understanding is flawed, my explanation has the same flaws. Some people are good at helping identify the false belief, but usually I still have to let that realization tumble around in my mind for a while before i feel comfortable enough to continue.

Re: Google got it wrong. The open-office trend is destroying the workplace

#75

Post by mwfunk »

krschultz wrote: post #59

The ultimate irony of open plan offices is that if you are considerate of your neighbors, you can't actually collaborate in the open part of the office. Every single time I want to talk to someone for an in depth period of time, we almost immediately move to a conference room so we don't disturb the people around us. If everyone had offices, I would walk into their office and we would not need to move after starting…

People characterize DRM as something that doesn't deter criminals but punishes honest consumers. I've often thought of open office plans in the same way. Unless someone's a jerk, they're not going to want to talk to anyone about anything in the actual open office area, which is the whole point of "increasing collaboration". They're going to whisper (which impedes communication) or grab whoever they want to talk to and go someplace where they're not disturbing other people.

On the other hand, the jerks are not going to think twice about it, and they'll just walk over to someone's desk and start talking at them, and not always with an indoor voice, much less actually trying to keep it down. Jerks 1, non-jerks 0.

Another very, very, VERY common thing I see on places like HN is people talking about how much they love being able to walk over and ask their coworkers questions all the time with open offices. Meaningfully, I don't see them complaining about other people asking them questions all the time due their increased visibility. This always makes it sounds like it just enables people who always ask someone else before trying to figure things out on their own. Jerks 2, non-jerks 0.

On the other hand, open offices are really good at making engineers deeply unhappy and unproductive, while allowing some director or VP to look like a hero for saving a bunch of money while "increasing collaboration". Jerks 3, non-jerks 0.

Re: Google got it wrong. The open-office trend is destroying the workplace

#76

Post by Apocryphon »

gnaritas wrote: post #62
jsprogrammer wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Busywork shouldn't be the goal. Busywork is what is given to children when the adults don't want to deal.

You're projecting, no one said anything about busy-work. Busy does not mean doing unproductive work. Busy != busy-work.

But it's inevitable that any job will involve some amount of busy-work. Such is the nature of work.

Busy-work isn't unproductive work- at least, not to the organization. Busy-work is work that the organization needs to have done, but the individual does not find interesting or satisfying to do. Any company is going to require busy-work.

Re: Google got it wrong. The open-office trend is destroying the workplace

#77

Post by amelius »

stevesearer wrote: post #35
dillon wrote: post #22

I think this has been a discussion going on for a long time now. What I believe to be true is it really depends on the person. If you're someone who is self-conscious then yes you'll feel like everyone is judging you all the time. If you have the ability to stay focused on your work without being around colleagues then you should be allowed to work from home. I've worked in open offices, offices with high partitions…

Agreed. I like the concept of Activity Based Working. http://space.ucsf.edu/activity-based-workplace

I think I'd prefer to be in the focus room almost all day :)

Re: Google got it wrong. The open-office trend is destroying the workplace

#79

Post by lrem »

simonsarris wrote: post #72

I imagine when google interviews candidates they don't do it in the open office, they probably go into a (quiet) conference room. That's at least a little telling, isn't it? Suggestion: Request to be interviewed in the actual seat/location that you're going to be working in and see what they say.

They'll probably tell you there are security considerations against that. The next time you interview with Google, if you get a building tour, pay attention to the "no photography past these point" and similar notices...

Re: Google got it wrong. The open-office trend is destroying the workplace

#80

Post by seanp2k2 »

stevesearer wrote: post #18

The pendulum seems to swing on this issue every 20-25 years on this issue so it makes a lot of sense we are seeing so many articles about how the open plan is terrible now. Wait 20 years and there will have been a big transformation in the workplace with more people working privately - likely with the addition of more work-from-home/remote arrangements. But there will be a push again at that point with new articles w…

Office space in the Bay Area is expensive, so is construction (even indoors). When you can put employees into 6x6 plots in an open space, everything else looks egregiously expensive.
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