Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

American students head to Germany for free college

marketplace.org

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

71–80 of 258 posts

Re: American students head to Germany for free college

#71

Post by rsp1984 »

DrinkWater wrote: post #46

I would have killed to get the chance to study in the US. American students are far more complex and broad in their knowledge. And that's a very good thing you shouldn't underestimate. It helps a lot in your career. Germany loves hierarchy and "conservative" thinking. And that is reflected in every aspect of society, even academic education. The main focus is to produce people that Germany needs. We have a shitload o…

Having grown up and studied in Germany and having lived and worked in the US too I know the differences quite a bit.

Yes, thinking is more narrow here in Germany and the "Fachidioten" that you are referring to are real. However, the depth and thoroughness of domain specific knowledge that you acquire with a German university degree are hard to beat, specifically in Engineering / STEM.

I would even go as far as to say that the top German Engineering Universities (Munich, Darmstadt, Aachen) are comparable to the top US universities in that area (Stanford, MIT, ...).

Now with regards to broadness of thinking and knowledge, it's true that the US values this much higher than Germany and the situation hasn't especially improved with the Bologna process in Germany. However the big argument is that German universities are free and cost of living is low. Then why not study in Germany and get some of the US mentality later in your professional life by working in the US?

I'd argue that valuing choice of college/university too high is a mistake that many people make. Instead figure out first what you want, focus on getting your skills and how to discover new opportunities in life. No college university can really help you with this.

Re: American students head to Germany for free college

#72

Post by doyoulikeworms »

[deleted] wrote: post #70
doyoulikeworms wrote: post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Agreed. But the German education system isn't like Anglo (e.g., US) systems. 27% of this generation of Germans have post-secondary education, compared to 43% of their American counterparts. Someone explained to me that this is due to Germany's focus on trades and apprenticeship.

[deleted]

Source? OECD put it at 27% in 2011[1]. If that number is 38% today, then over 2 million Germans earned post-secondary degrees in the last 4 years.

1: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_25%E2%80%9...

Re: American students head to Germany for free college

#73

Post by higherpurpose »

drvd wrote: post #18
tsotha wrote: post #2

How could this possibly make sense to German taxpayers?

Germans are not so obsessed about not paying taxes like e.g. Americans or Swiss. Nobody likes to pay taxes and everybody complains about the high taxes. But I think (actually hope!) that Germans understand (if only unconsciously) that happiness is much more depending on getting old without fear of poverty, knowing to be treated if ill, being able to go safely outside anytime anywhere, not dropping out of society if b…

If Germany is like other European countries, it also helps that your taxes are "automatically paid" to the government, usually by having the employer take them out of your salary and paying them. It's not like in US where Americans feel every dollar going to the government when they do their taxes. Since they are paid automatically, the income taxes aren't even on people's minds, usually.

However, if Europeans had to do their own taxes for their salaries, I'm sure many more would be upset about high taxes.

Re: American students head to Germany for free college

#74

Post by the_rosentotter »

gigigigihkv wrote: post #17
sonium wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Beside what was already said, one needs to consider that German universities have a much lower expense per student. This is because the universities have a chronic lack of money. This means that little is invested into 'feel good' facilities e.g. university run Gyms / extensive libraries. From my experience they offer little that is not essential to studying, but this doesn't keep them from providing a great educatio…

That's contrary to all my experiences. Gym/sports/languages courses/... are easily on par with US private unis, except less expensive.

Competitive college sports is pretty much non-existent in Europe.

Re: American students head to Germany for free college

#75

Post by allendoerfer »

stingraycharles wrote: post #23
drvd wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Germans are not so obsessed about not paying taxes like e.g. Americans or Swiss. Nobody likes to pay taxes and everybody complains about the high taxes. But I think (actually hope!) that Germans understand (if only unconsciously) that happiness is much more depending on getting old without fear of poverty, knowing to be treated if ill, being able to go safely outside anytime anywhere, not dropping out of society if b…

Also, you could argue that it is a good investment to have high educated foreigners receive their education in your country: it's like extending your business network on a nation-wide level.

I think so, too. Contacts become contracts.

Re: American students head to Germany for free college

#76

Post by tormeh »

iamjdg wrote: post #28

I am on a temporary work assignment in Germany (2 years). I would come back in a minute if I wanted to further my education. Its a great country, safe, modern, and residents (permanent or not) get a lot of support from the government. Free university is for the German people, but they extend it to foreigners because Germany needs people and they hope they stay. I've learned a lot in Germany I will take back with me a…

the ideal export to import ratio is 1, BTW. Anything else is an imbalance and a ticking bomb. The internal trade imbalances in the EU have already blown up once.

Re: American students head to Germany for free college

#77

Post by userulluipeste »

Maakuth wrote: post #55
Pirate-of-SV wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Education in Europe is not free. You pay with your qualifications. If your university grades are not good enough, you go out fast. Could you be a little more specific? The size of Europe, America and Asia is too huge for statements like that. There are definitely universities in Europe that are more similar to some in the US than other universities in Europe. I'm a student in Sweden and I have not experienced anyth…

It's the same in Finland, at least in universities. If you don't pass your courses, the state stops paying the student benefits[1], but you can stay at the university. There is another, very low number of courses you need to pass every year in order to stay in, but that is very low indeed, it's only meant to keep registers clean of people not studying at all. 1: That's right, Finns are paid to study. I think students…

"Finns are paid to study. I think students in most of the Nordic countries are."

There are scholarships (all over Europe) that depend on acquiring a minimal number of Bologna-credits, and those (at least in some countries) existed since the foundation of the higher education itself.

Re: American students head to Germany for free college

#78

Post by interdrift »

DrinkWater wrote: post #46

I would have killed to get the chance to study in the US. American students are far more complex and broad in their knowledge. And that's a very good thing you shouldn't underestimate. It helps a lot in your career. Germany loves hierarchy and "conservative" thinking. And that is reflected in every aspect of society, even academic education. The main focus is to produce people that Germany needs. We have a shitload o…

Having an university degree will soon be worthless ( not in our lifetimes ) but the revolution has already started. Online courses offer much better results for less money. In fact I think the best place you could be right now is : having a degree ( in which you didn't put all that much of an effort ) + work experience while you are studying + online courses from top universities.

Re: American students head to Germany for free college

#79

Post by interdrift »

[deleted] wrote: post #69
yodsanklai wrote: post #40

I wonder if American students fleeing their country to save on education tax is more than anecdotical. BTW, the article mentions Germany, but isn't education cheap in most European countries?

[deleted]

That highly depends on the university and the country.

Re: American students head to Germany for free college

#80

Post by brazzy »

doyoulikeworms wrote: post #65
_stephan wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

These broad statements seem ridiculous to me. If you're speaking from personal experience, you should at least add which subject you studied and at which Uni/FH you studied.

Agreed. But the German education system isn't like Anglo (e.g., US) systems. 27% of this generation of Germans have post-secondary education, compared to 43% of their American counterparts. Someone explained to me that this is due to Germany's focus on trades and apprenticeship.

The explanation is correct; about 50% of Germans go through a formal combination of apprenticeship and trade school.
Post reply on HN