If my business pays for a great programmer, I want that programmer's knowledge, experience and attitude to diffuse to the rest of my team (... not that I have a business, just sayin' :-). Much harder to do this if that great programmer isn't in the office.
How Paul Graham Is Wrong
71–80 of 206 posts
Re: How Paul Graham Is Wrong
#72The idea that remote work is a solution to immigration is also a meme on Twitter. I'm not sure I understand it. A San Francisco tech company can employ developers in Krakow to work remotely without dealing with visas. But those developers either need to be 1099 contractors, or loaned out from an outsourcing firm. Both options are poor. Outsourcing firms for obvious reasons (introducing a middleman that serves no purp…
Those aren't the options people are referring to on Twitter (at least not in the threads I've seen [0]).
It's about hiring US/Canada based people and not forcing them to relocate. Using Slack, Skype, screen-sharing, co-working spaces, etc. to collaborate and stay on top of everything. The kind of companies you see hiring at: https://weworkremotely.com/
I'm doing it at a great startup now and it's awesome. I've got kids and my wife is in college–I'm not relocating to SF.
Maybe there are intricacies to being in a heavily-funded, high-growth SF startup that prevent this ... I just don't know what they are and PG & sama aren't elaborating on them.
Re: How Paul Graham Is Wrong
#73>Use WordPress and P2, use Slack, use G+ Hangouts, use Skype, use any of the amazing technology that allows us to collaborate as effectively online as previous generations of company did offline. I've been a 100% remote worker for 5+ years but I think we have to be honest here. All those teleconferencing/videoconferencing/virtualwhiteboards/etc are not as effective as everyone sharing the same physical workspace. Yes…
"A lot of startups have ambitious goals and very hard technical challenges" And those companies aren't billion dollar companies either. "All those teleconferencing/videoconferencing/virtualwhiteboards/etc are not as effective as everyone sharing the same physical workspace" But they're more effective than those people not working together at all. "Remote workers even with today's fanciest collaboration technology is…
Videoconferencing sucks -- it's not as effective as having your coworker come over to your screen for pair programming, or talking face-to-face with your UXer. Anyone who has done any amount of remote work will realize that the OP is dramatically overstating the value of teleconferencing solutions compared to working in house.
Re: How Paul Graham Is Wrong
#74Earlier quoted context omitted.
From my perspective "living in germany" it would be very unattractive unless I were to earn substantially large sums. I would never be eligible for german retirement, would have to purchase the more expensive private ensurance, and would lose a lot of what I've paid in until now. So that is what I would stand to lose. I definately see how looking at from within the US this could be completely different, and there you…
So self employed people in Germany cannot set up their own company and pay the social security tax that way and build up an entitlement to benefits? Would take me less than a week to do that in the UK for a PLC.
I think this would be possible, but then again it would also mean you the employee would have to setup your own company to be able to work remotely for another one, and although the UG cost only 1 euro to start, you need to set aside 25% of yearly earnings until obtaining the base 25k for ensuring your newly founded company (GmbH). So this means a lot of hastle for what? The remote companies would need to offer serious perks to get people to jump through all these loops.
Re: How Paul Graham Is Wrong
#75>Use WordPress and P2, use Slack, use G+ Hangouts, use Skype, use any of the amazing technology that allows us to collaborate as effectively online as previous generations of company did offline. I've been a 100% remote worker for 5+ years but I think we have to be honest here. All those teleconferencing/videoconferencing/virtualwhiteboards/etc are not as effective as everyone sharing the same physical workspace. Yes…
Harder problems than the Linux kernel?
I've been remote for eight years now and I work on a codebase so huge that no one person understands it all beneath the 10,000 foot level. Nearly all of us are remote (only the managers are "local" to San Jose). Once a quarter we get together and meet up, coming from Vancouver, Toronto, Bangalore, Colorado and northern California.
Re: How Paul Graham Is Wrong
#76>Use WordPress and P2, use Slack, use G+ Hangouts, use Skype, use any of the amazing technology that allows us to collaborate as effectively online as previous generations of company did offline. I've been a 100% remote worker for 5+ years but I think we have to be honest here. All those teleconferencing/videoconferencing/virtualwhiteboards/etc are not as effective as everyone sharing the same physical workspace. Yes…
As another veteran of working remotely, I disagree. Conscious use of collaboration tools offsets not being in the same office together nicely. Real time communication via Hangouts or Skype are at a level where you can hold a good conversation without having to be in the same physical location.
Also, most offices (and businesses) are not really built to support proper collaboration and working conditions. As an example, due to a recent job move, I'm stuck in an office 80% of the time right now, and it's pretty miserable. It's an open office plan so there's constant noise and visual distractions, my boss can (and does) come over and interrupt me constantly on issues completely unrelated to my work, and in a former life the office was a welding garage, so I'm pretty cold most days this winter.
I hear of the unicorn offices, where they were built to support collaboration and focused development work, but I've always found reality has more in common with Dilbert than Valve.
Re: How Paul Graham Is Wrong
#77The idea that remote work is a solution to immigration is also a meme on Twitter. I'm not sure I understand it. A San Francisco tech company can employ developers in Krakow to work remotely without dealing with visas. But those developers either need to be 1099 contractors, or loaned out from an outsourcing firm. Both options are poor. Outsourcing firms for obvious reasons (introducing a middleman that serves no purp…
Just because someone is on a different kind of contract (say a monthly retainer paid by wire, versus employee of US company paid with direct deposit) doesn't mean you need to treat them differently. Every "Automattician" at Automattic is viewed the same regardless of how their employment contract happens to work, and as you scale larger you can set up subsidiaries overseas to directly employ people. (We look at this…
I have done about half my career as a 1099 or equivalent. There is no question that those are treated differently.
Re: How Paul Graham Is Wrong
#78Isn't there a tremendous upside to being physically co-located? Even if the teams are remote, are the founders not usually located in a 'tech hub' city (SF, NY, etc.)? Matt says to let people 'live someplace remarkable', but for most of the world that want to work in technology SF is someplace remarkable. The benefits of using group collaboration tools are still available, but you have other people working on overlap…
Most people would think so, but apparently this changes if you work for Yahoo!. Then you are a lot more productive if you work remotely. This is what I learned on Hacker News. ;)
Re: How Paul Graham Is Wrong
#79Earlier quoted context omitted.
"A lot of startups have ambitious goals and very hard technical challenges" And those companies aren't billion dollar companies either. "All those teleconferencing/videoconferencing/virtualwhiteboards/etc are not as effective as everyone sharing the same physical workspace" But they're more effective than those people not working together at all. "Remote workers even with today's fanciest collaboration technology is…
Videoconferencing sucks -- it's not as effective as having your coworker come over to your screen for pair programming, or talking face-to-face with your UXer. Anyone who has done any amount of remote work will realize that the OP is dramatically overstating the value of teleconferencing solutions compared to working in house.
Videoconferencing _used_ to suck. Four years ago, having a voice conversation while sharing a screen was neigh on impossible. Now, however, it's dirt simple and works really well.
Re: How Paul Graham Is Wrong
#80>Use WordPress and P2, use Slack, use G+ Hangouts, use Skype, use any of the amazing technology that allows us to collaborate as effectively online as previous generations of company did offline. I've been a 100% remote worker for 5+ years but I think we have to be honest here. All those teleconferencing/videoconferencing/virtualwhiteboards/etc are not as effective as everyone sharing the same physical workspace. Yes…
Agreed. I don't have a solution, but this frustrates me to no end.
As a software engineer that previously worked in an open floor plan I can testify that they absolutely crush individual productivity. Headphones are no solution. I think I'd need a potato sack on my head too.
But as a software engineer that currently works with geographically distributed teams, there's no way to deny that certain elements of communication can't be reproduced with chats and hangouts. It's not just technical discussions either - it's much harder to build cultural cohesion in distributed teams as well. Which is a bummer because it's a lot easier to engage in blame and scapegoating when the guy that wrote something is just some email address and not a friend.
I wonder if anybody has had success with some sort of 80/20 (remote/on-site) model...