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Is the NYPD About to Start Ticketing More Cyclists Due to a Mathematical Error?

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Re: Is the NYPD About to Start Ticketing More Cyclists Due to a Mathematical Error?

#71

Post by markcerqueira »

jff wrote: post #44

I wish all police everywhere started ticketing for more traffic violations. When everyone on the road--cyclist, motorist, and pedestrian--follows the rules precisely, traffic is predictable and safe. When morons wave you through at a 4-way stop, or turn without signaling (yay California), or blow red lights on their bicycle, you have to go into extra-defensive mode because the road is no longer predictable.

I remember getting a lot of shit from my California friends in college (I'm from New Jersey). Going on living 4 years in California and can conclude that California drivers are a different flavor of terrible at driving!

Lesson learned: I'm the best driver in the world!

Re: Is the NYPD About to Start Ticketing More Cyclists Due to a Mathematical Error?

#72

Post by Strang »

jff wrote: post #44

I wish all police everywhere started ticketing for more traffic violations. When everyone on the road--cyclist, motorist, and pedestrian--follows the rules precisely, traffic is predictable and safe. When morons wave you through at a 4-way stop, or turn without signaling (yay California), or blow red lights on their bicycle, you have to go into extra-defensive mode because the road is no longer predictable.

I see people complain about waving at a four-way stop all the time, and I really don't get it. I wave people through at four-way stops all the time, for the simple reason that it can be hard to tell who arrived first. Especially with rolling stops and the like.

So rather than assume that the other drivers have come to the same conclusion that I have, I make it explicit by waving. Sometimes it's a little confusing if they try to wave you at the same time, but that's life.

Re: Is the NYPD About to Start Ticketing More Cyclists Due to a Mathematical Error?

#74

Post by ericHosick »

jff wrote: post #44

I wish all police everywhere started ticketing for more traffic violations. When everyone on the road--cyclist, motorist, and pedestrian--follows the rules precisely, traffic is predictable and safe. When morons wave you through at a 4-way stop, or turn without signaling (yay California), or blow red lights on their bicycle, you have to go into extra-defensive mode because the road is no longer predictable.

> because the road is no longer predictable

It will never be fully predictable: people make mistakes. It is always safer and better to assume that someone will do something unpredictable like run a red light. It could even be because of mechanical error.

When riding motorcycles in ~~Asia~~ some asian countries (did it for 6 years), you assume that people will run the red light. It happens, during rush hour, 100% of the time.

So, you drive appropriately and it is safer because of that.

Edit: changed Asia to some asian countries. I didn't want to be specific but ended up being to general which was wrong.

Re: Is the NYPD About to Start Ticketing More Cyclists Due to a Mathematical Error?

#75

Post by freehunter »

ceejayoz wrote: post #68
PaulHoule wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It astonishes me how much (many) cyclists blame everybody else for the dangers they are exposed to. For instance, you even see bicycle cops riding their bikes on the wrong side of the street. If they're chasing a suspect or heading to a crime scene I'll forgive it, but they usually aren't in a hurry and are actually ignorant of the law they are supposed to enforce. As a pedestrian I have been hit multiple times by cy…

> For instance, you even see bicycle cops riding their bikes on the wrong side of the street. You know, this one I understand entirely. When I walk on a road without sidewalks, I always walk on the wrong side of the road, so I can see what's coming and whether they're paying attention. Getting mowed down from behind by someone not looking where they're going isn't on my bucket list.

Walking towards oncoming traffic is, if not the law, then at least the sanctioned way of walking. Riding your bike into oncoming traffic, though, IS against the law since a bicyclist is considered a vehicle just like a car.

Re: Is the NYPD About to Start Ticketing More Cyclists Due to a Mathematical Error?

#76

Post by jeffwass »

ceejayoz wrote: post #68
PaulHoule wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It astonishes me how much (many) cyclists blame everybody else for the dangers they are exposed to. For instance, you even see bicycle cops riding their bikes on the wrong side of the street. If they're chasing a suspect or heading to a crime scene I'll forgive it, but they usually aren't in a hurry and are actually ignorant of the law they are supposed to enforce. As a pedestrian I have been hit multiple times by cy…

> For instance, you even see bicycle cops riding their bikes on the wrong side of the street. You know, this one I understand entirely. When I walk on a road without sidewalks, I always walk on the wrong side of the road, so I can see what's coming and whether they're paying attention. Getting mowed down from behind by someone not looking where they're going isn't on my bucket list.

Cyclists are vehicles, so are obligated to follow the rules of the road and drive on the correct side.

Pedestrians, in the absence of sidewalks, do have the option to face incoming or outgoing traffic, and the usual choice is to face oncoming traffic as you suggested.

Re: Is the NYPD About to Start Ticketing More Cyclists Due to a Mathematical Error?

#78

Post by apaprocki »

jff wrote: post #44

I wish all police everywhere started ticketing for more traffic violations. When everyone on the road--cyclist, motorist, and pedestrian--follows the rules precisely, traffic is predictable and safe. When morons wave you through at a 4-way stop, or turn without signaling (yay California), or blow red lights on their bicycle, you have to go into extra-defensive mode because the road is no longer predictable.

In NYC I couldn't want this more. For example, traffic on the Queensboro bridge gets backed up regularly entering Manhattan in the morning. If you go down to the streets the bridge exits out onto, cars/trucks are routinely parked on the sides of the road during prohibited rush hour windows, essentially restricting traffic down to 1 lane instead of the intended 2 or 3. All it takes is 1 traffic cop to be assigned the beat during the mornings for such important streets and I think traffic would improve pretty dramatically (aside from generating more revenue for the city). I can't ever recall anyone being ticketed for "blocking the box" despite menacing signs even when there is a traffic cop standing in the intersection.

Re: Is the NYPD About to Start Ticketing More Cyclists Due to a Mathematical Error?

#79

Post by slayed0 »

ceejayoz wrote: post #68
PaulHoule wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It astonishes me how much (many) cyclists blame everybody else for the dangers they are exposed to. For instance, you even see bicycle cops riding their bikes on the wrong side of the street. If they're chasing a suspect or heading to a crime scene I'll forgive it, but they usually aren't in a hurry and are actually ignorant of the law they are supposed to enforce. As a pedestrian I have been hit multiple times by cy…

> For instance, you even see bicycle cops riding their bikes on the wrong side of the street. You know, this one I understand entirely. When I walk on a road without sidewalks, I always walk on the wrong side of the road, so I can see what's coming and whether they're paying attention. Getting mowed down from behind by someone not looking where they're going isn't on my bucket list.

Walking is different because you can stop on a dime and dive out of the way if you see trouble coming. On a bicycle, however, you are usually unable to do this.

Additionally, the increase in speed differential (which is much more significant for cyclists than pedestrians) created by cycling towards oncoming traffic greatly reduces available reaction time of both parties.

When you are travelling in the same direction as the traffic there is usually still a speed differential but it is substantially less. While you no longer have the ability to see potential problems "coming at you", drivers have significantly more time to notice you and react accordingly.

Re: Is the NYPD About to Start Ticketing More Cyclists Due to a Mathematical Error?

#80

Post by PJDK »

jasonjei wrote: post #37

As a motorcyclist, I think cyclists should be held to the same rules of the law as other vehicles to make driving predictable and safe. As it stands right now, I have to assume cyclists (via heuristics/profiling) as a wildcard--will they run a red light? Will they weave in and out of traffic unsafely (this is an acceptable practice, when done with ample buffer given their size and speed)? I think cycling is great (I'…

As a cyclist (and a pretty law abiding one at that) I absolutely want you to treat me as a wildcard, one that you have to pay extra attention to since I'm in a pretty vulnerable position on the road.

It's fine to put cars in a "probably won't do anything unpredictable" box, if the worst comes to the worst there'll be some paperwork to fill in (might not be true for you on a motorbike of course). A cyclist the worst thing that will happen will be to the cyclist.

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