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Core Secrets: NSA Saboteurs in China and Germany

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Re: Core Secrets: NSA Saboteurs in China and Germany

#71

Post by [deleted] »

xnull2guest wrote: post #18
meowface wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I actually condone a lot of the NSA's activities, but I take serious issue with: -Warantless surveillance of US citizens (this is bad whether it's by law enforcement, intelligence agencies, or anyone). -Infiltration of foreign companies in allied or neutral nations purely for economic or geopolitical insight, not for military purposes (Brazil's Petrobras oil company, all sorts of spying in Germany and Norway and othe…

> Warantless surveillance of US citizens (this is bad whether it's by law enforcement, intelligence agencies, or anyone). Agreed very strongly. > Infiltration of foreign companies in allied or neutral nations purely for economic or geopolitical insight, not for military purposes (Brazil's Petrobras oil company, all sorts of spying in Germany and Norway and other places). See this is where the NSA really shines. We (T…

[deleted]

Re: Core Secrets: NSA Saboteurs in China and Germany

#72

Post by pluma »

illumen wrote: post #37

TLDR; Secret police do secret police things.

More like: the US can't get rid of its Cold War era habits.

The Cold War never ended. It was just extended from US vs the Soviet Union to US vs everybody else.

But what do you expect from a nation that is now de facto in a perpetual state of war with an amorphous, heterogeneous and strictly confidential blob of groups, nations and assorted individuals that includes its own citizens.

Re: Core Secrets: NSA Saboteurs in China and Germany

#74

Post by stfu »

xnull2guest wrote: post #2

“The facts contained in this program constitute a combination of the greatest number of highly sensitive facts related to NSA/CSS’s overall cryptologic mission,” the briefing document states. “Unauthorized disclosure…will cause exceptionally grave damage to U.S. national security. The loss of this information could critically compromise highly sensitive cryptologic U.S. and foreign relationships, multi-year past and…

Somewhat sad to see the cyber security war narrative becoming the top voted comment on hackernews.

Until the public realize that they are themselves the target of those cyber security war activities by their own government, those revelations can not be damaging enough.

Just to support the point: Today the new Snowden movie is all over the news, while practically nobody seems to care bout those revelations you claim being really damaging.

Re: Core Secrets: NSA Saboteurs in China and Germany

#75

Post by psaintla »

t-rex1 wrote: post #73

Revealing mass surveillance is one thing (great!), but some of these leaks feels like revealing too much and some of whats meant to be protecting us...no??

I've been a Snowden supporter but this is the kind of information that gets people killed. I'm not sure how comfortable I am with this. He proved his point a long time ago is this really necessary?

Re: Core Secrets: NSA Saboteurs in China and Germany

#76

Post by t-rex1 »

psaintla wrote: post #75
t-rex1 wrote: post #73

Revealing mass surveillance is one thing (great!), but some of these leaks feels like revealing too much and some of whats meant to be protecting us...no??

I've been a Snowden supporter but this is the kind of information that gets people killed. I'm not sure how comfortable I am with this. He proved his point a long time ago is this really necessary?

I agree..

Re: Core Secrets: NSA Saboteurs in China and Germany

#77

Post by psaintla »

t-rex1 wrote: post #76
psaintla wrote: post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've been a Snowden supporter but this is the kind of information that gets people killed. I'm not sure how comfortable I am with this. He proved his point a long time ago is this really necessary?

I agree..

I know..

Re: Core Secrets: NSA Saboteurs in China and Germany

#78

Post by spopejoy »

xnull2guest wrote: post #18
meowface wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I actually condone a lot of the NSA's activities, but I take serious issue with: -Warantless surveillance of US citizens (this is bad whether it's by law enforcement, intelligence agencies, or anyone). -Infiltration of foreign companies in allied or neutral nations purely for economic or geopolitical insight, not for military purposes (Brazil's Petrobras oil company, all sorts of spying in Germany and Norway and othe…

> Warantless surveillance of US citizens (this is bad whether it's by law enforcement, intelligence agencies, or anyone). Agreed very strongly. > Infiltration of foreign companies in allied or neutral nations purely for economic or geopolitical insight, not for military purposes (Brazil's Petrobras oil company, all sorts of spying in Germany and Norway and other places). See this is where the NSA really shines. We (T…

It seems you've decided that US hegemony is a "good thing" regardless of the moral implications for ourselves and the world. However, some find actions like the following to be dangerous, immoral, unnecessary:

* "the US and Israel had the director assassinated"

* "we won offshore drilling"

* the blase assertion that a nuclear Iran is any worse than the existing nuclear powers (especially Israel!!!)

"Energy security" is oil company nonsense, hilarious considering their tireless efforts to block any kind of clean alternative. The OPEC crisis saved us from gas guzzlers, and now we're back to having SUV's everywhere. We could use some "energy insecurity" but with fracking we're now an exporter. Oil forever!! Climate be damned.

I disagree also with attempts to close off the discussion by saying "geopolitics are important." The US does not have to subvert governments, install dictators across the globe, prop up Saudi Arabia, blindly support Israel, be the muscle for Big Oil (and assassinate and imprison folks at home, too).

The moral hazards that have created this situation are to blame, but it doesn't help that our leaders are as a group paranoid and uncreative, all too willing to let militaristic fascists (accurate, not name-calling here) drive their decision-making.

Edward Snowden is a hero, full stop. You can't do enough damage to the NSA, these types must be resisted at all times.

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