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Rare 'goat-sheep' born on Irish farm

bbc.co.uk

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Re: Rare 'goat-sheep' born on Irish farm

#71

Post by marshray »

saalweachter wrote: post #45
giardini wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Humans and gorillas? What about our ancestors and those of pigs? I found this hypothesis fascinating: "A chimp-pig hybrid origin for humans?" http://phys.org/news/2013-07-chimp-pig-hybrid-humans.html from the article: " I asked McCarthy if he could give a date estimate for the hybridization event, he said that there are a couple broad possibilities: (1) It might be that hybridization between pigs and apes produced th…

Basically, no. While goats and sheep diverged 8 million years ago, humans/chimps and pigs diverged 80 million years ago . The last time a proto-chimp got with a proto-pig, the T-Rex hadn't evolved yet. While goats and sheep have a difference of 6 chromosomes, chimps and pigs have a difference of 10. McCarthy, despite being a geneticist, makes his absurd claim without even discussing the genetic difficulties. What lit…

I think he's saying relatively modern chimps and pigs may have had a hybridization event.

Another argument was that the morphological distance, or genetic differences besides chromosome number, are just too great. Most of us are familiar with the platypus. A paper published in Nature a few years ago demonstrated that the platypus genome contains both bird and mammal chromosomes, and therefore that the vastly different bird and mammal sex chromosome systems have been successfully bridged by this creature. This example is not offered as any kind of proof. But it does suggest that sometime, long ago, a cross occurred that would have been even more distant than that between a chimpanzee and a pig – one between a otter-like mammal and a duck-like bird. And if such was the case, the hybrids from the cross must have been able to produce offspring (otherwise they would have died out, and the platypus would not exist today).

http://phys.org/news/2013-07-human-hybrids-closer-theory-evi...

Re: Rare 'goat-sheep' born on Irish farm

#72

Post by JshWright »

Bizarrely enough, this article caused me to lose an argument with my sister-in-law... Months ago she insisted such a hybrid would be called a 'geep.' I agreed with the general idea, but felt it would be better if it were spelled 'gheep'...

For the record, I still think my spelling is better...

Re: Rare 'goat-sheep' born on Irish farm

#73

Post by Houshalter »

guhemama2 wrote: post #66
upquark wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Wolves and dogs are the same species too, AFAIK

They have the same genus (Canis), but their species are different.

Different subspecies. Considered the same species though (Canis lupus.)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Subspecies_of_Canis_lupus

Re: Rare 'goat-sheep' born on Irish farm

#74

Post by Houshalter »

Steuard wrote: post #60
grey413 wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The champion of the theory attributes the lack of genomic similarity to repeated back-crossing to one of the parent populations. To put it in other words, the droplet of initial hybridization got diluted in the larger gene pool, but the novel genes (and thus traits) remained and underwent selection. That being said, diluted gene contribution is not the same thing as no gene contribution. To even begin accepting such…

I saw that claim in the article, yes. I'll admit that I don't know enough about genetics to make strong claims here, but it doesn't sound remotely plausible to me. He wants to simultaneously claim that 1) hominids got so much porcine DNA that they have lots of substantial, recognizable anatomical features as a result, and 2) hominids have so little porcine DNA that it's all but invisible in our genetic code. I'm not…

I don't see why it's that implausible. You are descended from almost every single human being alive 1,000 years ago. Can you find any significant amount of DNA contributed from only a single one of your ancestors?

What he is suggesting is that a single hybrid made it's way back into the hominid population. It had children with other hominids, and those children would have had half as much pig DNA. They had children with even less, and so on. After awhile there would be almost nothing left of the pig ancestor. The only genes that would survive such dilution would be ones that were significantly selected for.

Re: Rare 'goat-sheep' born on Irish farm

#75

Post by ronaldx »

dang wrote: post #54
watsitbang wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I guess we've just found out how we're going to be treated by the new moderators. eps was obviously trying to be helpful to lacero. If lacero was hell-banned, he wouldn't know it to email you, would he? And for his trouble he gets this mean reply from you.

I try hard not to be mean. If you'd care to suggest how to improve my wording, I'd be happy to. It's possible that my frustration after a year and a half of reading such comments as eps's with no ability to reply to them leaked through. A better way for eps to help lacero, if that's all he or she wanted to do, would have been to email and ask us to check why lacero's comment was dead. We would have replied with a tha…

> A better way for eps to help lacero, if that's all he or she wanted to do, would have been to email...

This is now understood, but you say it in a severe way - as though you think it should have been obvious for eps to know this. You seem to be making an assumption that, by not doing what you prefer, eps was deliberately acting with negative intent.

From an outside point of view, it is very hard to understand how eps should have known what your preference was (even after rechecking the Guidelines and FAQ). As such, it is hard to understand that eps's intent was anything but positive.

Re: Rare 'goat-sheep' born on Irish farm

#76

Post by Houshalter »

repsilat wrote: post #61
viraptor wrote: post #36

> the farmer said he was not planning to send the geep for slaughter I'm ignorant about most things farm-related, but maybe someone knows what rules apply to meat coming from unusual mixes? I assume it's harmless to eat it, but would it be legal to sell?

My first thought was, "I hope it isn't sterile." If goat/sheep hybrids are this rare then a fertile "bridge" (even in one direction) would be of some scientific (and agricultural) interest. Food is a distant second...

It might also be of benefit to introduce it's genes back into the population. Diversity is usually good and maybe goats have some genes that are beneficial to sheep or vice versa. As far as I know, most hybrids are sterile though.

Re: Rare 'goat-sheep' born on Irish farm

#79

Post by spullara »

Houshalter wrote: post #74
Steuard wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I saw that claim in the article, yes. I'll admit that I don't know enough about genetics to make strong claims here, but it doesn't sound remotely plausible to me. He wants to simultaneously claim that 1) hominids got so much porcine DNA that they have lots of substantial, recognizable anatomical features as a result, and 2) hominids have so little porcine DNA that it's all but invisible in our genetic code. I'm not…

I don't see why it's that implausible. You are descended from almost every single human being alive 1,000 years ago. Can you find any significant amount of DNA contributed from only a single one of your ancestors? What he is suggesting is that a single hybrid made it's way back into the hominid population. It had children with other hominids, and those children would have had half as much pig DNA. They had children w…

"You are descended from almost every single human being alive 1,000 years ago." Um. No.
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