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Did these guys just reinvent the Web?

javaworld.com

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Re: Did these guys just reinvent the Web?

#71
post #56

> Welcome to famo.us > a javascript engine and framework that solves HTML5 performance And doesn't work in Firefox. Aweso.me!

Ah, is that why http://famo.us just looks like a blurry pile of laundry to me? But most importantly: didn't Intel release around this time last year JIT compilation of Javascript to run on their HID (GPU onboard CPU)? (wouldn't that make slow-execute javascript a non-issue?)

Well it would if Javascript execution speed was the issue, but as the article highlights, they're using Javascript to replace slow browser rendering, and the argument is that JS is, in the case of matrix transformations, 80% the speed of native C, and using that to replace the renderer for animations in a browser is faster than the native render.

Of course, faster JS is never wrong.

Re: Did these guys just reinvent the Web?

#72
post #17

Off topic: Why does it say Urasium Michael Arrington ? Urasium was a typo in some Apple demo event. [0] https://twitter.com/onesleepynerd/statuses/34425107788713164...

Hmm, note that "Urasium" in the Apple demo has an atomic weight of 238.0289, while this one changes the weight to "Michael Arrington". I think the famo.us people may have been calling Michael Arrington an ass.

Re: Did these guys just reinvent the Web?

#73
post #62

Its quite terrible on this workstation, so I'm gonna have to go with a no. Also isnt offloading everything to the GPU a bad idea on mobile?

Nope, it is a great idea on mobile, at least for iDevices and I imagine most Android devices. Especially with high dpi screens, leaving everything on the CPU is too slow.

Re: Did these guys just reinvent the Web?

#74
post #62

Its quite terrible on this workstation, so I'm gonna have to go with a no. Also isnt offloading everything to the GPU a bad idea on mobile?

I'm gonna go with 'no'; GPU's should be a lot faster (read: more specialized), and thus more power-efficient than general-purpose CPU's. In theory. Disregarding optimizations in general purpose CPU's in mobile.

Re: Did these guys just reinvent the Web?

#75
Hard to imagine what they could be adding to CSS3 transforms - composite transforms can be done efficiently without calculating them manually anyway (by using the DOM tree as a "scene graph"). I experimented with this some time ago as well [1]

But even bigger question than the performance is, what kind of 3D user interface would be more effective in conveying a message than a clean, regular 2D website that everybody feels familiar with. Curious to see if they will bring some UI design innovations here

[1] https://github.com/asaarinen/spherical-map

Re: Did these guys just reinvent the Web?

#77
post #25

Seems browsers are obsolete and are now just getting in the way. People are trying to use every loophole and new technology possible to bypass features implemented in browsers. I think it's time browsers took a step back and gave more control to developers. It's time for a major rethink of what a browser should be/do.

"Seems browsers are obsolete and are now just getting in the way. People are trying to use every loophole and new technology possible to bypass features implemented in browsers."

Warning: unpopular view ahead. It's a bit ranty, too.

That's because we're hell-bent on doing everything in browsers in the first place. Somewhere along the way, we collectively decided that write-once run-anywhere would become reality, damn the consequences. We just wouldn't call it that anymore - to do so would raise the spectre of desktop java which has essentially shit the bed. Instead, we'll call it "standards".

It's a most peculiar definition of "standards" though. These standards are a shifting target, receiving regular modification. Every major vendor can claim compliance regardless of whether they are actually compliant - after all, vendor prefixes. And many front-end developers extoll the virtue of these 'standards', apparently believing that the libraries and tooling that hide the inconsistencies from them are actually a solution instead of a band-aid.

We've been trying for "write-once-run-anywhere-but-don't-call-it-that" [WORABDCIT] for years. And we've made such progress - in another decade we may actually have consistent standard support across browsers. Of course, we haven't had this for the last decade so I'm not sure why we're perpetually hopeful that we will in the next.

And that's not even getting into performance. Because these 'standards' are built atop so many layers that applications built on them can very, very rarely provide performance like an application actually built for a native platform does. Leading to a whole discipline of computer science with a goal of performance that merely approaches native speed on a consistent basis.

Back when I first started in my career, I remember building native application UIs that were poorly coded, inefficient and bloated. Hell, I used MFC for love of K&R. Yet this crap still ran faster on a Pentium III than the majority of "web apps" run on the latest hardware.

A native application is nearly always going to be faster than javascript through a browser. For most applications being developed, it will provide excellent performance - even on ARM -- without any tuning, tweaking, shortcuts, or loopholes. It will give an experience consistent with the rest of the platform, so that users aren't having to learn a new UI paradigm with every hot new app.

You can even integrate technologies into a native app that still allow you to communicate with back-end components over http/https - go figure. A well-written native library is cross-platform (thanks to meaningful standards), so that only the UI bits would differ.

The cost is more time building. A loss of some flexibility. Levelling up some basic skills, perhaps raising the barrier of entry a bit. A step back from RAD practices that have become so rapid that it's become common for a new "app" to be deployed knowing it will break under stress and worry about fixing it later. Not saying that this didn't happen before - but I am saying it wasn't accepted as the norm to the degree it is now.

But nah. Native is yesterday. Why on earth would we want to take fullest advantage of modern hardware to provide a good user experience? Let's continue to reinvent the browser. We'll keep on with WORABDCIT because sooner or later, we're bound to come up with standards that are finalized and implemented consistently.

Really. We will.

Re: Did these guys just reinvent the Web?

#78

> Welcome to famo.us > a javascript engine and framework that solves HTML5 performance And doesn't work in Firefox. Aweso.me!

Didnt seem to work in IE10 (Only other browser installed on this machine) either.

I had a look in IE9. All I found were a couple of video demos. I was left to reflect on what it is to reinvent something.

Re: Did these guys just reinvent the Web?

#79

Would using "-webkit-transform: matrix3d" allow a way for websites to use a computers GPU for computation? I.e. stay on a page to calculate pi, work on SETI analysis, or mine for bitcoins?

yes and that has been done already. I posted somewhere on this page links to it, in case you're interested.

Re: Did these guys just reinvent the Web?

#80

Without reading the article I can unequivocally answer > Did these guys just reinvent the Web? with NO, you hyperbolic twit.

Well, that’s just Betteridge’s Law of Headlines. Also, it’s an article on a website called ‘javaworld’.

http://25.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_m9wcxw5pU81rrf1eeo1_500.jp...

JAVAWORLD!!!!! lol.

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