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Revealed: Qatar's World Cup 'slaves'

theguardian.com

71–80 of 147 posts

Re: Revealed: Qatar's World Cup 'slaves'

#71

As someone who lives in the Emirates, I have to object to the allegation of "slaves." This is not slavery. It's indentured servitude, which is definitely distressing but not quite of the same character. Most importantly, in the talks I've had with workers, the vast majority of them still are happy to have these jobs despite the conditions. They're paid an order of magnitude more than they make in Nepal and if you go…

Do you think they'd be paid in full at the end of their period? From the pattern of treatment described in the article, I'd expect it's common for them to be left unpaid or underpaid at the close.

Re: Revealed: Qatar's World Cup 'slaves'

#72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

IMO you are spot on that its FIFA's fault for choosing the location. The Cup will be moved to the winter and will affect European football due to league play. The US was runner up and should have been awarded the World Cup in 2022. The 1994 Cup in the US was one of the most, it not the most, profitable World Cup. The infrastructure is in place in the US to host the World Cup. Can you imagine what political ramificati…

Do you have sources for it being so profitable? For who? Everything I understand about events like the World Cup and Olympics is that they are massively wasteful, corrupt, publicly funded economic disasters. Is that just the Olympics?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Economics_of_the_FIFA_World_Cup

It was one of the most profitable World Cups, take into account that it was in 1994.

Re: Revealed: Qatar's World Cup 'slaves'

#73

This is shocking... how? The arab empire was built on the slave trade. The whole of Dubai exists solely due to external workers, from engineers to the bricklayers. This should not shock anyone.

The only shocking thing is how we in the US put up with this behavior from governments we send billions in aid to every year. You'd think we'd have the balls to suspend some their aid and have them put an end to this type of abuse.

The aid is to get their govt support against war on terror and access to resources no?

Which really shows that we have our priorities set straight too. They are not our people slaving away there, so we turn a blind eye.

Re: Revealed: Qatar's World Cup 'slaves'

#74
post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Scare quotes are quotation marks placed around a word or phrase to imply that it may not signify its apparent meaning or that it is not necessarily the way the quoting person would express its concept. Thus, the quotes are used to establish a use–mention distinction, in a similar way as verbally prefixing a phrase with "so-called". When referred to as "scare quotes", the quotation marks are suggested to imply skepti…

Well, to be exact they are not real slaves http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Slavery , at least in the way slavery existed in USA.

You can always narrow a concept to exclude members of a set if you are allowed to declare your preferred definition, but the general use of the word slave obviously includes forced labourers who are being denied wages and held against their will while being worked to death and denied water, to argue otherwise would seem to make an utter mockery of the term.

Re: Revealed: Qatar's World Cup 'slaves'

#75
post #2

From the article: • Evidence of forced labour on a huge World Cup infrastructure project. • Some Nepalese men have alleged that they have not been paid for months and have had their salaries retained to stop them running away. • Some workers on other sites say employers routinely confiscate passports and refuse to issue ID cards, in effect reducing them to the status of illegal aliens. • Some labourers say they have…

I lived and worked in Qatar and none of this is new to me. These people are treated in horrible conditions and I don't think Qataris have a second thought about it. They genuinely believe they are superior people and are permitted to do this to those lower than them (I am generalizing, yes, there are some good people there, but this is the most pervasive mindset. Just look up horror stories of how Filipina maids are treated in Qatari households. Rape victimes are at the Philippines embassy there every day trying to get help).

It was a really terrible place, don't be seduced by the media coverage gushing about their wealth. It's very easy to be

This is a government that charges fines from their red light cameras in excess of a year of a laborer's salary. They then require an "exit visa" to depart the country, and you can't get the exit visa until all your debts are paid, and your employer gives you one. I knew of Sri Lankan cab drivers who were trapped for years in Qatar trying to pay off their fines so they could leave.

Even as a professional American your employer can abuse you if they feel like it thanks to the "exit visa" requirement. Oh, you're quitting? Fine, I'll keep your last paycheck, here's your exit visa. Nobody should take a country that has an "exit visa" requirement seriously! I could not deal with the pressure of my freedom literally being in my employers hands. I did not last there very long in this environment, I am never going back to that hellhole.

Re: Revealed: Qatar's World Cup 'slaves'

#76
post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not sure it's helpful to call this actual slavery. Actual slavery is when human beings are legally owned by others. This is not actual slavery, but it is atrocious working conditions and very serious human rights violations. The conditions may approach slave-like conditions, so there's good reason to use the word, but quotation marks are probably accurate. This is journalism, after all, not propaganda. (But, you…

The distinction is purely academic, and worthless for real-world use. Sex slaves in America or the UK are not legally owned, but they are nevertheless slaves as far as anybody sane-minded is concerned. You would not dream of referring to them as "Sex 'slaves'" . Particularly, The Guardian has not made this distinction in the past, search for "site:theguardian.com sex slaves" (Further note that one of the methods of c…

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Re: Revealed: Qatar's World Cup 'slaves'

#77
post #9
post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sounds like modern day slavery to me

That is exactly what it is. The author and/or editor should have had a spine and made the headline: "Revealed: Qatar's World Cup slaves"

In England that would read like hack journalism. It would cheapen the paper and make people doubt the story.

Re: Revealed: Qatar's World Cup 'slaves'

#78

Terrible. This reminds me of what was going on in Saipan 20 years ago. A paradise of conservative/libertarian economic governance that Jack Abramoff and Tom Delay worked so hard to protect from the horrors of organized labor and worker's rights. http://www.nytimes.com/1993/07/18/world/made-usa-hard-labor-...

hold up. in no way is/was Saipan a paradise of libertarian economic governance. From your article: "If we complain, then our bosses would send us back to China and take away all of our money. Our families need the money."

No libertarian I know, me included, would object to (rather, we would support) massive penalties for any entity that engaged in such behavior.

Additionally, Jack Abramoff and Tom Delay are the exact opposite of anything/anyone a libertarian would endorse.

I really encourage you to learn about Libertarianism because if you really believe Saipan 20 years ago was a "paradise of libertarian economic governance" you are farrrr off the mark.

Re: Revealed: Qatar's World Cup 'slaves'

#79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do you have sources for it being so profitable? For who? Everything I understand about events like the World Cup and Olympics is that they are massively wasteful, corrupt, publicly funded economic disasters. Is that just the Olympics?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Economics_of_the_FIFA_World_Cup It was one of the most profitable World Cups, take into account that it was in 1994.

The most comprehensive source (and most recent, and only source about the economics I can still find) to this page suggests that it was an economic catastrophe that "showed a cumulative loss of $5.6 billion to $9 billion."[1] It's the same argument politicians use to swindle taxpayers into publicly financing stadiums for billionaire sports owners.

[1] http://articles.latimes.com/2010/sep/07/opinion/la-oe-coates...

Re: Revealed: Qatar's World Cup 'slaves'

#80
post #52
post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That is exactly what it is. The author and/or editor should have had a spine and made the headline: "Revealed: Qatar's World Cup slaves"

You're ascribing American notions of journalism to a British paper. They are not scare quotes.

Yes, our libel laws are much stronger. And scarier in scope.
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