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Elon Musk To Traverse The U.S. Using A Model S In 6 Day Trip

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Re: Elon Musk To Traverse The U.S. Using A Model S In 6 Day Trip

#71

Post by colanderman »

cobrausn wrote: post #39
matznerd wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's obnoxious to use gasoline...it's just the norm so it doesn't seem so.

No, it's not. Every 300 or so miles you stop and pump gas for a few minutes at any number of available locations, and then you move on. You don't have to plan your trip around gas station locations. If charge stations become ubiquitous so that isn't a requirement then this is ameliorated somewhat. I've always had this silly idea for an electric car company that sells cars but 'loans' out the batteries. When you want…

This is exactly what Shai Agassi tried doing with Better Place [1]. Sadly they're bankrupt now.

[1] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Better_Place

Re: Elon Musk To Traverse The U.S. Using A Model S In 6 Day Trip

#72

Post by colanderman »

simias wrote: post #40
avar wrote: post #7

> At 1.5 hrs/day, we will only ever need to > charge when stopping anyway to eat or sightsee, > never just for charging itself. I'm all for the development of electric cars but downplaying having to stop at what's effectively a gas station in the middle of nowhere for 1.5 hours per day is pretty disingenuous. You wouldn't get a lot of people buying a normal gasoline powered car if it took 1.5 hrs to fill it up each t…

I've seen the idea of simply replacing the batteries with charged ones in stations thrown around quite a bit in previous discussions and it always seemed the perfect solution to me. It's even faster than pumping gas (if done correctly) and you don't have to worry about your battery capacity degrading (when the station detects a battery won't hold less than a certain amount of charge it'd but the battery offline for r…

This is exactly what Shai Agassi tried doing with Better Place [1]. Sadly they're bankrupt now.

[1] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Better_Place

Re: Elon Musk To Traverse The U.S. Using A Model S In 6 Day Trip

#73

Post by kgermino »

oijaf888 wrote: post #63
kgermino wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Depends on where you go. For instance, I've looked at driving Milwaukee to SF and would plan on doing it in 2.5 days. On the other hand, I've driven Chicago to Yellowstone and we took 4 days to get there. The biggest difference I see is that 80 is he most mind numbingly boring road in this country whereas (at least until Utah, even where Wyoming is a pretty drive there's not too much worth stopping for) along 90 or 9…

I-10 is far more boring once you get into Texas and head west imo. 80 wasn't too bad since there were small towns, even if they didn't have much going for them, they at least allowed you to stop for a bit and maybe get a bite to eat. There's not even that in much of West Texas.

Ouch.

I probably shouldn't have spoken so absolutely. I've driven in most of the (Continental) U.S. but I've never been much North of Boston (i.e. Maine) or to some of the more desert regions of of the far southwest (Arizona, New Mexico, West Texas area). I have flown to San Diego though so maybe I'll just make sure to never drive there :)

Re: Elon Musk To Traverse The U.S. Using A Model S In 6 Day Trip

#74

Post by jusben1369 »

flexie wrote: post #14
avar wrote: post #7

> At 1.5 hrs/day, we will only ever need to > charge when stopping anyway to eat or sightsee, > never just for charging itself. I'm all for the development of electric cars but downplaying having to stop at what's effectively a gas station in the middle of nowhere for 1.5 hours per day is pretty disingenuous. You wouldn't get a lot of people buying a normal gasoline powered car if it took 1.5 hrs to fill it up each t…

It's free. If you could get gasoline for 200 miles for free, would you mind waiting for 30 minutes? I guess it's $25-30 worth of gasoline, corresponding to $50-60 per hour of waiting. I could wait. With the battery swap that Tesla is now introducing, you could also chose to swap the battery in a couple of minutes.

I would mind waiting 30 minutes on my own and with children in the car doubly so. Yes.

Re: Elon Musk To Traverse The U.S. Using A Model S In 6 Day Trip

#75

Post by R_Edward »

adrianpike wrote: post #64
R_Edward wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A) Consider the technological acumen of the average filling station worker. Is that the guy you want to be in charge of determining whether any given battery is fit for reuse? B) Consider the weight of an average automobile's starter battery. Not the sort of thing that a petite woman like my wife would be able to sling around on her own. If you hire battery jockeys to swap them in and out, that increases the cost. C)…

You're slightly off on a few points. A is handled in an automated fashion, in a similar way to many other modern service intervals. You don't have your average BMW or Mercedes mechanic hooking up Siemens bits to jigs to verify traces in the same way that you wouldn't have your "average filling station worker" checking all the LiPo cells. Battery health checks are already built into the vehicle. B is handled by relati…

My point is simply that swapping batteries is not a simple, do-it-yourself process. The batteries are heavy, bulky (at least for now), and inconveniently shaped and mounted, necessitating additional labor, tools, and time to swap. And a battery of unknown provenance may harbor damage that is invisible to the human eye--there needs to be a health checker at the point of swapping, because if you don't get that checkup until after it's mounted in your car, you risk having to waste your time doing a second swap. And that equipment is also going to drive up the cost.

I suspect that convenience and cost will tip the scales away from swapping and toward recharging, especially if the recharge cycle can be sped up and the infrastructure build-out continues.

Re: Elon Musk To Traverse The U.S. Using A Model S In 6 Day Trip

#76

Post by jccooper »

stephenhuey wrote: post #45
cobrausn wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, it's not. Every 300 or so miles you stop and pump gas for a few minutes at any number of available locations, and then you move on. You don't have to plan your trip around gas station locations. If charge stations become ubiquitous so that isn't a requirement then this is ameliorated somewhat. I've always had this silly idea for an electric car company that sells cars but 'loans' out the batteries. When you want…

Once upon a time, I'm sure you couldn't get very far in a gasoline-powered car because there weren't many gas stations. Also, Elon is already trying the battery swap idea: http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2013/06/22/tesla-motor...

Indeed. Many early cross country motorists had to buy small bottles of gasoline at pharmacies (where it was sold as some sort of topical treatment, I think.)

Re: Elon Musk To Traverse The U.S. Using A Model S In 6 Day Trip

#77

Post by jared314 »

smackfu wrote: post #57

Remember that this answers the question "Can you get an electric car from coast-to-coast?" and not "Can you use an electric car for your coast-to-coast vacation?" And that Tesla wants you to think it's the latter. Clever marketers.

It echoes the first coast-to-coast trip by H. Jackson and S Crocker[1] in 1903, except Musk is starting from LA instead of San Francisco.

[1] http://amhistory.si.edu/onthemove/exhibition/exhibition_7_2....

Re: Elon Musk To Traverse The U.S. Using A Model S In 6 Day Trip

#78

Post by dredmorbius »

alphakappa wrote: post #58
DanBC wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Won't the interesting places want to attract people who can afford expensive cars? Won't they start to add charging points?

The inferesting places are not always private properties that are trying to attract people. On my road trips, I often end up stopping and stretching my legs at scenic overlooks, hiking trails, lakes etc, none of which are likely to sprout charging stations any time soon.

Agreed. I could point you at any of a number of highly memorable breaks I've taken pretty much out in the middle of nowhere.

But you've got to eat. And if the place is interesting to the level of offering food, the bonus of adding a charging station should be a reasonably good investment.

I think the point is that Tesla are likely to have their choice of charging locations as they build out their network, and even non-SuperCharger stations will offer some range extension for the cost of a 220AC outlet.

Re: Elon Musk To Traverse The U.S. Using A Model S In 6 Day Trip

#79

Post by DanBC »

alphakappa wrote: post #58
DanBC wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Won't the interesting places want to attract people who can afford expensive cars? Won't they start to add charging points?

The inferesting places are not always private properties that are trying to attract people. On my road trips, I often end up stopping and stretching my legs at scenic overlooks, hiking trails, lakes etc, none of which are likely to sprout charging stations any time soon.

I often forget how big the US is.

But the government builds roads, and taxes[1] some road users. It's in the government's interest to provide some kind of infrastructure for lower carbon transport.

Providing a few thousand charging points for electric vehicles seems a reasonable thing for government to do, so long as those are vendor-neutral and can be used by any electric vehicle.

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