Why are clients shocked by the price for web development? • Hacker News Board

Re: Why are clients shocked by the price for web development?

#71

Post by Jhsto » Sat, May 11, 2013, 6:22 PM UTC

evdawg wrote: post #31

This is an extremely complicated question. I run a UI/UX studio here in Toronto and we go all up and down the spectrum, with some clients being shocked at our prices for web design/development but we've also lost jobs from other prospective clients because our prices were too low (no joke). It depends on two things: 1. Where you get your business 2. Who your competition is For many, #2 depends on #1. We see three mai…

Great comment.

I'am a self entrepreneur and I do some web designing from time to time. I recently got a lead for a organization which had EU funding of 250'000€. They wanted me to roll two sites with independent designs and features which's content had to be editable. I offered them my full consultation in choosing everything from ground up, but they kept on asking for the price. Once I told them I never heard anything back.

I offered to do the sites for about 0.5% stake of what they got from EU, but they apparently thought it was too much.

Recently a friend of mine was observing me coding and he was astonished of the complexity of it. As he said, 'For me, a button has always been just a button with no further functionality.' I also let him to change the source code as he was interested to see what effects it has on the program. He deleted a single bracket and was amazed to find that the program failed to run. I then continued to tell him that no matter how big your codebase is, a single mistake such as that might screw it all.

He now understands my frustration better.

Re: Why are clients shocked by the price for web development?

#72

Post by swayvil » Sat, May 11, 2013, 6:27 PM UTC

Even more amazing is when you aren't dealing with a client (who is by definition clueless) but a manager (who really should know what it is that he is managing).

Ex : "This client's site is all fucked up. A simple upgrade isn't possible because it was written 3 version back and the formats for everything changed. Rewrite it from scratch using this hideously complex tool which you've never touched before. It'll take you only 40 hours, right?".

Re: Why are clients shocked by the price for web development?

#73

Post by n0mad01 » Sat, May 11, 2013, 6:32 PM UTC

Jhsto wrote: post #71

evdawg wrote: post #31

This is an extremely complicated question. I run a UI/UX studio here in Toronto and we go all up and down the spectrum, with some clients being shocked at our prices for web design/development but we've also lost jobs from other prospective clients because our prices were too low (no joke). It depends on two things: 1. Where you get your business 2. Who your competition is For many, #2 depends on #1. We see three mai…

Great comment. I'am a self entrepreneur and I do some web designing from time to time. I recently got a lead for a organization which had EU funding of 250'000€. They wanted me to roll two sites with independent designs and features which's content had to be editable. I offered them my full consultation in choosing everything from ground up, but they kept on asking for the price. Once I told them I never heard anythi…

well, maybe that ~1000€ were far to low.

Re: Why are clients shocked by the price for web development?

#74

Post by vamega » Sat, May 11, 2013, 6:42 PM UTC

noahsark769 wrote: post #70

keenerd wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Stuff like this is why I usually set my smallest clients up with a static html generator. (At least if they don't want comments, and then we consider Disqus before wordpress.) It is really hard to have vulerabilities with static html. Similarly, hosting these costs nothing. Usually in the ballpark of $3/year, the DNS alone is the dominate cost. And if they do get a sudden inrush of traffic, static hosts need to see a…

Just wondering, where do you get static hosting for $3 a year?

Amazon S3, could probably host a static site for around this price.

Re: Why are clients shocked by the price for web development?

#75

Post by [deleted] » Sat, May 11, 2013, 7:13 PM UTC

noahsark769 wrote: post #70

keenerd wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Stuff like this is why I usually set my smallest clients up with a static html generator. (At least if they don't want comments, and then we consider Disqus before wordpress.) It is really hard to have vulerabilities with static html. Similarly, hosting these costs nothing. Usually in the ballpark of $3/year, the DNS alone is the dominate cost. And if they do get a sudden inrush of traffic, static hosts need to see a…

Just wondering, where do you get static hosting for $3 a year?

[deleted]

Re: Why are clients shocked by the price for web development?

#76

Post by ciclista » Sat, May 11, 2013, 7:43 PM UTC

jiggy2011 wrote: post #69

droithomme wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Just so you know, semiskilled housecleaners charge a lot more than $25 an hour. Car mechanics $60-$120 an hour. Plumbers $80-$120 an hour. When you charge $25 total for a trip to his facility, the time to understand his business problem, and an hour of setting up software for him, you are telling the client "I have no skills and am not worthy of any respect. Please abuse me."

Well I didn't have to go onsite for this, or I would have definitely charged more. Though I would say that installing PHP scripts to web hosts is closer to semi-skilled labour since it can be (and frequently is) done by teenagers. Plumbing or mechanicing have a higher barrier to entry since you usually need certifications and a significant outlay for tools/transport/premesis etc.

The main value to the customer wasn't ftp'ing the files over, it was the technical understanding to find a script of value, make sure it was written properly, documented, etc. Not to mention the time you took to understand their issues.

Re: Why are clients shocked by the price for web development?

#77

Post by krapp » Sat, May 11, 2013, 8:06 PM UTC

vinceguidry wrote: post #29

blindhippo wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I cut my teeth building wordpress/drupal brochure sites for small businesses. I have inherited custom web sites for these customers who got duped by some punk developer who didn't feel like using an established solution. I want to punch all developers in the mouth who think a custom application for this type of situation is a good idea. They give us all a bad name and exacerbate the cost problem.

I want to smack all the developers and designers who think Wordpress is "good enough". It's not. It's an unmaintainable mess. Every client-run Wordpress site I touch is disgustingly out of date and everything added since the first design looks like crayon drawings done by five-year olds with ADD. I don't see much Drupal in the wild so I can't comment on that. Web development has not reached the state where non-techni…

It's not a matter of Wordpress being 'good enough', as much as being sometimes 'what the client wants and all they're willing to pay for.' You're not wrong about the codebase though, but it's not entirely the fault of developers.

Re: Why are clients shocked by the price for web development?

#78

Post by c16 » Sat, May 11, 2013, 9:25 PM UTC

noahsark769 wrote: post #70

keenerd wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Stuff like this is why I usually set my smallest clients up with a static html generator. (At least if they don't want comments, and then we consider Disqus before wordpress.) It is really hard to have vulerabilities with static html. Similarly, hosting these costs nothing. Usually in the ballpark of $3/year, the DNS alone is the dominate cost. And if they do get a sudden inrush of traffic, static hosts need to see a…

Just wondering, where do you get static hosting for $3 a year?

I host my personal website on relichost.net, it's £6/year but for my one page 'about me' and some simple email it's more than enough.

Also I hadn't thought of S3 - that's a good shout.

Re: Why are clients shocked by the price for web development?

#79

Post by cajuntrep » Sat, May 11, 2013, 10:49 PM UTC

Because non-technical people have no idea what you do. If I were to freelance or do web development I would position myself on the high end, and only target those customers. When you have customers that appreciate your work and don't think price is an issue, then you have the choice to choose who you want to work with.

ie. Raise your rates! :)

Re: Why are clients shocked by the price for web development?

#80

Post by piotr_krzyzek » Sat, May 11, 2013, 11:00 PM UTC

A good chunk of my core business is web development and have been doing this for quite some time now. There are many factors that go into the buyers decision making process.

A large part of that is perception. Most buyers do not see websites as a high ticket items. Many see it as either just another business expense they have to make or they do not think it's worth investing into because it will not give them much of a return on their investment.

If your clients are shocked by the prices you give them, then there is miscommunication between your value & message and what they think their are getting. It's all about managing expectations.

When talking with the prospect about their future goals, and they mention they just need a website that (and I quote from a client here): "is very simple and just lists my name, my companies name and an address." That is NOT a client who will pay any sort of real money for a website. That type of client is best lead to the $10 website services. ... at least for me. I do not want to be dealing with such a low end client.

Though, one follow-up to such a client request that I've used to great success is:

Me: Just to make sure I'm understanding your correctly, you're looking for a ultra simple website that is essentially a business card but online right?

most of the time they will answer:

Them: Well, no not a business card. I'd want to be able to put some article on there, pictures, and there really should be a way for people to contact me through the site.

Me: Ah, so it's not something so 'simple' is it? Let's talk about what your business goals are. Where do you see your company being in 3 months? 6 months? 1 yr? Do you know to use the website at all for any sort of lead generation, information gathering and in-bound marketing?

At this point, they will usually start realizing that there is a lot of high value items to do done. Their needs and actual budget will now dictate which you and they will be able to take.

If you're unsure of what they can afford, you can always say something like:

"A project like this usually start around $15,000. Do you have a budjet allocated for a project like this? .... No? Ok, what do you believe it is worth and there are ways we can reduce this price by removing some items of value, so what value would you like to remove so that we can fit it into your budget?"