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Stop Killing Games: It's time to sue Sony, join us

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Re: Stop Killing Games: It's time to sue Sony, join us

#71

Post by ekianjo »

braiamp wrote: post #69
IshKebab wrote: post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hmm but when that argument was applied to phones, Android essentially got punished for being more open than Apple - you actually can have other app stores on Android, therefore Google could be held accountable for anti-competitive actions in the Android app marketplace. Whereas Apple doesn't allow any third party app stores so there's no competition in the first place and they're fine! Retarded logic but I feel like…

What the heck are you talking about? Both Apple and Google were hit by the EU anti-gatekeeping law. I am not going to engage with the rest since it's based on a supposition that is plainly wrong.

So Apple in the EU allows for alternative app stores?

Re: Stop Killing Games: It's time to sue Sony, join us

#72

Post by ekianjo »

zamadatix wrote: post #58
unpopularopp wrote: post #14

So McDonald's has a monopoly on the Big Mac? Because you can go to Burger King (Xbox) or KFC (Switch) or Sonic (PC) as well but this group is arguing they want to have a Big Mac but not from McDonald's? Or actually McDonald's doesn't have a monopoly because you can technically buy a Big Mac from Uber Eats or Doordash?

This same kind of note seems to come up repeatedly in threads like this with no regard to a similar question ever having been thought up or discussed every other time the topic comes up. Different brands of course, but I'm not sure I've actually seen a net new discussion of this point here in years. The usual answer is: If Sony raises the price of games in it's store, Sony denies 3rd party stores, and Sony removes th…

> then there are a significant number of people no longer able to consider open market dynamics in picking which low dollar game to buy next as they have massive (in comparison) investments in the platform.

Nothing prevents them from selling their Sony console and moving on

Re: Stop Killing Games: It's time to sue Sony, join us

#73

Post by choo-t »

ekianjo wrote: post #71
braiamp wrote: post #69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What the heck are you talking about? Both Apple and Google were hit by the EU anti-gatekeeping law. I am not going to engage with the rest since it's based on a supposition that is plainly wrong.

So Apple in the EU allows for alternative app stores?

Yes, with some caveat ("notarization" and "core technology fee").

Re: Stop Killing Games: It's time to sue Sony, join us

#74

Post by braiamp »

clhodapp wrote: post #68
braiamp wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Nobody is questioning consumer behavior, consumers would buy bread with sawdust if it was cheaper, they don't because we have standards to protect consumers that makes it illegal to sell it. This is the same principle but with a more subtle harm.

Consumers would buy bread with sawdust and then, upon learning about it, expect the sawdust to come out and the price to stay the same

So you agree that consumers mostly see the sticker price and don't think much about the quality of the product, therefore there must be protections ensuring that the product is at least fit for purpose.

Re: Stop Killing Games: It's time to sue Sony, join us

#75

Post by 999900000999 »

MBCook wrote: post #63
999900000999 wrote: post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because that's the only way Sony doesn't have a monopoly on what software you can run on your hardware. PC gaming lets me shop from Steam, GOG, etc. I can't do any of that on a closed system.

No it’s not. Laws are. Why ask that the fire doors in a building are unlocked when it’s on fire? Maybe they just shouldn’t ever be locked.

Ok. Even then you'd only be able to install specific PS5 software. Which no one can build without a license from Sony.

Re: Stop Killing Games: It's time to sue Sony, join us

#76

Post by CivBase »

keoneflick wrote: post #52
braiamp wrote: post #38

If people actually read the claims... it's about fair business practices, this is why they are suing Sony: > ... In the EU, it is forbidden for large companies to abuse their position to make more profit at the expense of consumers. Yet Sony does not fully abide by these rules. > > If you buy a digital game or in-game content, Sony will only ensure that you can do so through its own PlayStation Store. Sony keeps the…

> Sony does not fully abide by these rules. If you buy a digital game or in-game content, Sony will only ensure that you can do so through its own PlayStation Store. I have assumed that retail locations will continue to sell game codes, just not game disks, post disks going away. Currently there are games from like Just Dance that only include a game code in the retail box rather than game CD because of the way the g…

Why on earth would I go to a game store to buy a code?

Re: Stop Killing Games: It's time to sue Sony, join us

#77

Post by wilg »

stingraycharles wrote: post #33
wilg wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The large upfront cost is lower than it would be because its subsidized by buying the games for it! Sony does make the games, they have many excellent first party studios! What are you talking about!

They make games, they just don’t make all the games. Similar like a grocery store having their own brands in the shelves, you don’t expect to be able to buy these at other shops. And yes the upfront costs being subsidized is exactly the point.

I can only respond to what you actually said which was "Sony doesn’t actually make the games" and "they don’t have the kitchen nor the cooks".

Re: Stop Killing Games: It's time to sue Sony, join us

#78

Post by fladrif »

lopatin wrote: post #57

You can sue whoever you want. But this reads of backpedaling and righteousness to me. The quote below are not my words, but are from a prior comment on HN, which I think are relevant. ``` I in no way mean this to be rude, but I think a big part of why the EU isn't in the same galaxy as the US in the realm of business in general, is in some part, the knee jerk reaction to turn to the government to make products and se…

2 Points; Regulation is not the antithesis of Innovation, Monopolies break the Game.

This point keeps coming up, regulation in europe stifles their innovative capacity, with silicon valley's companies brought up as show horses. Outside of tech I'm not sure what other "business" the US is so dominant in. In tech, so much can be attributed to network effects and compounding interest (loosely speaking) that it can't be so trivial to say anyone else with less regulation can mimic it.

You can't beat monopolies with innovation. You beat monopolies with regulation, but even then left unchecked monopolies and the entrenched wealth it generates can overcome regulatory bodies and subvert their intentions.

Re: Stop Killing Games: It's time to sue Sony, join us

#79

Post by wilg »

ytoawwhra92 wrote: post #34
wilg wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The large upfront cost is lower than it would be because its subsidized by buying the games for it! Sony does make the games, they have many excellent first party studios! What are you talking about!

> The large upfront cost is lower than it would be because its subsidized by buying the games for it! This isn't true anymore.

As far as I can tell, despite Sony saying they would like the consoles to be profitable, they are still subsidized as of right now in aggregate. Perhaps some models are more profitable than others.

Re: Stop Killing Games: It's time to sue Sony, join us

#80

Post by wilg »

braiamp wrote: post #46
wilg wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The large upfront cost is lower than it would be because its subsidized by buying the games for it! Sony does make the games, they have many excellent first party studios! What are you talking about!

The PS5 was breaking even less than 6 months after its release. They don't subsidize anything. BTW, Nintendo also don't subsidize it. The BOM of the Switch 1 and 2 is lower than the total price including the margins for retailers!

This is a conversation about Sony, not Nintendo. As far as I can tell from current data, Sony is still subsidizing PlayStation consoles overall.
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