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Mac gaming is finally getting the overpowered upgrade it deserves

macworld.com

71–80 of 92 posts

Re: Mac gaming is finally getting the overpowered upgrade it deserves

#71
post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They claim enough of Rosetta will continue to exist for games and things like wine to work. I suspect the main thing they want to kill off are all the x86 slices in the mach-o fat binaries for all of the frameworks.

Do you have a source on that, them claiming continued support for "things like wine"?

My source is I know how they handled Intel 32-bit support for Wine the last time they deprecated it. They went out of their way to keep codeweavers happy even though they let all the 32bit games on steam straight up die.

Re: Mac gaming is finally getting the overpowered upgrade it deserves

#72
post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Most of those are gonna work using Rosetta, crossover, and the game porting toolkit. You really don’t need Apple to support 32Bit x86 macOS games when it’s not much more overhead to run windows x86 games (which is easily the better library to spend time Optimizing for).

Why bother with macos version at all then? Soon current version becomes unusable as well, and needs windows fallback to run since macos version is useless

If there's a macos port, it'll of course be better optimized. I play CS2 on mac from time to time. It runs really smoothly on my Studio, but if it were a native port I could run it on a macbook air.

Re: Mac gaming is finally getting the overpowered upgrade it deserves

#73
post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Most of those are gonna work using Rosetta, crossover, and the game porting toolkit. You really don’t need Apple to support 32Bit x86 macOS games when it’s not much more overhead to run windows x86 games (which is easily the better library to spend time Optimizing for).

Kind reminder that Rosetta is being removed.

It isn't; they specifically have said it will be retained. They aren't too specific but I think what they mean is all the Framework and App support for it will be gone. But as far as keeping a lot of self contained games and wine running I think it'll likely continue to work fine.

Re: Mac gaming is finally getting the overpowered upgrade it deserves

#74
post #19

This, once again, misses the elephant in the room. The fact is simple, there isn't enough of a Mac gaming market for the game developers to go through the effort. The hardware has been good enough for a while now. I'm not saying this will never change but the developers that shipped games on PC and Mac report something along the lines of 6-11% of users use a Mac. That isn't worth the effort unless you have a very str…

I think you are right. I suspect any mac gaming share that gets bootstrapped will have to come the crossover/proton way. Thats probably good enough for starters.

Re: Mac gaming is finally getting the overpowered upgrade it deserves

#76
post #68
post #45

Apple could easily make gaming on Mac feasible by contributing to Proton, Wine, DXVK and officially supporting Vulkan at least through translation layer. Or just partner with Valve to do exactly this for their platform. Instead they choose to build another proprietary solution nobody gonna use and that will die as soon as they lose interest.

My theory is that Apple chooses to make gaming a second class experience on Mac because they don't want the Mac brand to be associated with the main demographics that play AAA games.

A strange thing to comment on an article specifically about a toolkit produced by Apple to improve gaming on Macs.

Needlessly dismissive of a large swath of people too.

Re: Mac gaming is finally getting the overpowered upgrade it deserves

#77
post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My theory is that Apple chooses to make gaming a second class experience on Mac because they don't want the Mac brand to be associated with the main demographics that play AAA games.

A strange thing to comment on an article specifically about a toolkit produced by Apple to improve gaming on Macs. Needlessly dismissive of a large swath of people too.

I’m not claiming to like the choice (I don’t) merely that it likely is the real motive for Apple.

Re: Mac gaming is finally getting the overpowered upgrade it deserves

#78
post #68
post #45

Apple could easily make gaming on Mac feasible by contributing to Proton, Wine, DXVK and officially supporting Vulkan at least through translation layer. Or just partner with Valve to do exactly this for their platform. Instead they choose to build another proprietary solution nobody gonna use and that will die as soon as they lose interest.

My theory is that Apple chooses to make gaming a second class experience on Mac because they don't want the Mac brand to be associated with the main demographics that play AAA games.

Granted this is just my personal spend, but Apple has lost out on something like $12k of hardware sales from me over the past six years because they don’t support gaming. I switched to Linux in 2020 because it meant I could have a proper development environment AND play games. Before I was split between Windows and Mac, having to buy two machines— one for gaming and one for development.

If Apple didn’t treat gaming like a red-headed step child I’d have never made the switch. Now, it’s an incredibly steep uphill battle to win me back to MacOS. Linux slaps and NVidia has way better performance (though I wish I could get more than 32GB of VRAM without forking over $10k).

So yeah, while they might not like stereotypical gamer[1] types, I’m sure they’d like their money. For me the only Apple device I buy is a new iPhone once every 4-5 years. My lifetime value (to Apple) is essentially roughly 25%-33% of what it would have been if they supported gaming.

[1] I think more people play games now than ever before. While 20 years ago gaming might have been niche, we have multiple generations at this point who have been playing video games their entire lives. Realistically, it’s only boomers who haven’t played video games (or had access to them) the majority of their lives.

Re: Mac gaming is finally getting the overpowered upgrade it deserves

#79
post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why bother with macos version at all then? Soon current version becomes unusable as well, and needs windows fallback to run since macos version is useless

If there's a macos port, it'll of course be better optimized. I play CS2 on mac from time to time. It runs really smoothly on my Studio, but if it were a native port I could run it on a macbook air.

*for a brief moment it actually runs.

from the point of the dev - work done on the port will rot very soon, return of investment is really low. Also, the studio may not exist at all by time changes will be necessary - as fast as few days after public release nowadays :(

Re: Mac gaming is finally getting the overpowered upgrade it deserves

#80
post #16

I don't think the Game Porting Toolkit is useful these days: LLMs one-shot ports from one graphics API to another. Just like programming languages, graphical API choice is irrelevant now.

You're going to need a source for an LLM one-shotting a port of a AAA title from one graphics API to another...

The binary is the source.
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