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Briar is in maintenance mode

briarproject.org

71–80 of 114 posts

Re: Briar is in maintenance mode

#71
Anything that tries to read a "mailbox" on a smartphone is bound to run into difficulties. Smartphones manage to keep battery life high by keeping the modem inactive most of the time. The way to implement any mailbox functionality, i.e. an incoming message that needs attention, is usually done through a centralized push notification endpoint socket. Rather than wasting battery life polling multiple sockets, the OS listens to a single endpoint and farms out pushes that way. Of course to tune this precisely for battery life and for centralization of the platform, both Apple and Android have their own push notification services. Rooted or 3rd party smartphones can change the push notification service.

Any service like Briar that wants to sit atop base smartphones will need to deal with this tension. A fallback is to poll intermittently for new messages, which when tuned correctly can indeed be fairly battery life forward. Of course then your messaging experience is lower bounded by your refresh interval. Modern smartphone OSes also will ruthlessly cut long-running connections in the face of power-save events on device.

In general I think an external radio that you connect your smartphone to via Bluetooth, like Meshcore or Meshtastic, is a better experience overall than simply using a smartphone. Dedicated radios keep smartphone batteries topped up, and having the option to setup an antenna means that if you happen to be in an area where permanent radio setup is plausible, you can lean on good site characteristics, antennas, and filters. It’s hard for a government to ban radios altogether and ISM-ish band devices have a variety of uses in pretty much any developing or developed country (often used in small things like meters or monitors.) And for folks who just some off-grid data capabilities, this approach offers high flexibility without the burden of licensing.

For folks considering going into this, I suggest joining Meshtastic or Amateur Radio communities. I find the further you get from amateur radio or networking communities (mesh* communities have a mix of folks and some can have pretty poor understanding of how radios work), the more the information becomes unreliable and more suffuse with political/social goals than matters like understanding signal propagation or congestion. If you’re in a developed country, Amazon likely has all you need to get started with the Mesh* world of LoRa UHF radios.

Re: Briar is in maintenance mode

#72
post #47
post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

$200 mean very different things to different people. I would never say it's "reasonable" to expect anyone (including maintainers) to contribute money or code to an open source project. Must be easy for you to type these things from your comfortable armchair.

So what's the point of spending months and months and months of your time just to shut down your project when it could possibly be worked out for several $100? Is the situation that the authors have a lot of time and no money? Could we get the project some money if that's the case? Apps like this are so important. Every year they become more critical. And I would like if someone could please confirm is this related t…

It seems that you still haven't realized the gigantic hole in your arguments even after I already pointed them out.

If you don't know what open source software is or how projects are typically run (including where the funding, if any, comes from), educate yourself before posting meaningless texts in a forum.

Re: Briar is in maintenance mode

#73

> unreliable background operation on android Pretty much every app I have has delayed notifications, and no matter of battery optimization settings can fix it.

Do you use VPN? This is a common misconfiguration of a server-side NAT related to too long or too short NAT timeouts combined with "act like a blackhole if we don't know anything about this connection".

No, not on that phone...

Re: Briar is in maintenance mode

#74

> unreliable background operation on android Pretty much every app I have has delayed notifications, and no matter of battery optimization settings can fix it.

It seems to me this only happens if you don't use the app much. Or maybe some apps are "allowlisted", I've never had delayed WhatsApp/Slack notifications.

On Android, FCM notifications sent with priority HIGH are usually available within 30 seconds and bypasses Doze (unless you're on ultra battery saver mode). Notifications sent with normal priority run within doze windows, so every 15 minutes or more.

Unused apps also indeed go in different App Standby buckets, which while it shouldn't affect FCM notifications, it does on some older android versions (https://developer.android.com/topic/performance/power/power-...)

If you're not using FCM, well you're limited to having to check for notifications yourself, either within doze windows, or by registering a foreground service that keeps your app alive and checking.

Re: Briar is in maintenance mode

#75
post #2

Sounds like it's basically dead. The issue with messenger apps is that they're a dime a dozen, there are so many of them and they offer so much variability in security, privacy, but most importantly usability and uptime. If your friends won't switch to them, there's almost no point in having them or using them.

Briar was unique in its ability to discover peers over local networks and Bluetooth - Very few if any other messaging apps do that.

Unfortunately the security/usability tradeoffs mean it never was going to hit Whatsapp levels of use, but it certainly fills an important niche.

Re: Briar is in maintenance mode

#76
post #31

CIA funding dried up. Briar had already started development when Starlink wasn't even a concept. Nowadays every CIA goat herder has their own Starlink terminal.

> Nowadays every CIA goat herder has their own Starlink terminal.

Can the Starlink radio be sniffed? If so, it might act like a beacon, a tell-tale sign (especially, in countries where Starlink is illegal).

Re: Briar is in maintenance mode

#77
post #59
post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I agree. These are classic problems where LLMs really shine. I would be very surprised if GPT-5.6 couldn't fix them.

From the minimal context I got, it seems like there are underlying platform access problems in the way. In my experience, attempting to work around these issues is demoralizing.

Yes, it's demoralizing for a human. Which is why it's good for an LLM. They have no problem implementing these soul crushing workarounds.

Re: Briar is in maintenance mode

#79
post #64

> unreliable background operation on android Pretty much every app I have has delayed notifications, and no matter of battery optimization settings can fix it.

Some time back, I had a similar problem: the LineageOS Messaging app was frequently late with SMS notifications when the phone was in idle state. Adding the package to Android's deviceidle whitelist fixed it right up. (This was done with the dumpsys shell command, since the setting for com.android.messaging was not exposed in the GUI.) https://source.android.com/docs/core/power/app_mgmt#testing-... I wonder if this s…

Fairly sure the user whitelist is equivalent to "Unrestricted background usage", which should be visible for user-installed apps like Briar. I have a couple of apps that need this setting enabled, and there isn't an API or manifest flag to toggle it.

Re: Briar is in maintenance mode

#80
post #72
post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So what's the point of spending months and months and months of your time just to shut down your project when it could possibly be worked out for several $100? Is the situation that the authors have a lot of time and no money? Could we get the project some money if that's the case? Apps like this are so important. Every year they become more critical. And I would like if someone could please confirm is this related t…

It seems that you still haven't realized the gigantic hole in your arguments even after I already pointed them out. If you don't know what open source software is or how projects are typically run (including where the funding, if any, comes from), educate yourself before posting meaningless texts in a forum.

> It seems that you still haven't realized the gigantic hole in your arguments

> educate yourself before posting meaningless texts

Sorry, but you are being a jerk.

They just ask why someone putting so much effort into a project would not want to spend 200$ on saving it. That is a totally fair question. And you seem to be completely missing why spending 200$ on AI wouldn't solve the problem. Which is okay. But being a jerk while being wrong is not a good combination IMO.

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