Some context to this is recently the big "step 1" board exam that covered the basic science portion of medicine went from being graded to being pass/fail. Since then, all the medical students where I work have started trying to get any kind of research on their CV to stand out during their residency application. New 120 participant "conferences" where med students can present posters are popping up, more med students trying to get into the labs for rotations than ever before. A lot of it is really low quality, but for them, if they don't have any research, and someone else does, they will be ranked lower and get worse jobs. Weird effect of whatever happened to make Step 1 pass/fail
Medical students are using popular research tool to pump out misleading studies
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Re: Medical students are using popular research tool to pump out misleading studies
#72My assumption is the credibility of a non-PhD-holding medical student’s research is 0, just like (almost) any other inexperienced researcher.
a friend of a friend who did a stint in biomedical academia told me that the researchers in their field did not hold research coming from the medicine community in high regard
How can you tell when you are reading a paper?
Re: Medical students are using popular research tool to pump out misleading studies
#73My potentially unpopular opinion: Congress should ban residency programs from using Medicare training dollars to pay for research. They should do this with the goal of speeding up the training pipeline for actual practitioners, many of whom are now required to spend a year of their residency doing research of some kind. If medical residents, or teaching hospitals, want people to do research, they should go get fundin…
Congress should end the AMA guild's chokehold on linking "Medicare" to medical training at all. It's a complete grift.
Re: Medical students are using popular research tool to pump out misleading studies
#74As a former scientist it's embarrassing how easily the dismal state of science today could have been predicted decades before by applying Goodhart's Law, or any simple train of thought on incentives and moral hazard. Instead we chose to assume scientists collectively behave on a higher plane. No wonder the general public distrusts "the intelectual elite", we deserved it.
This article is about MD doctors, not scientists (although there may be some MD-PhDs in it, and yes MDs can get research positions). MD doctors poll at extraordinarily high levels of trust, over almost any other professional group in the United States. So it really isn't correct to directly link this article's topic to "distrust". The effect you're talking about may exist in science, but this article is essentially a…
MD doctors (and even to a large extent DO doctors nowadays) are philosophically grounded on science. An MD fundamentally practices science. That used to be one of the key differences between MD and DO physicians, but science has been so successful at advancing the standard of care that DOs cannot ignore it anymore. That's just to say that MDs are expected to be fluent in science and it's not some arbitrary expectation of bureaucracy run amok.
Re: Medical students are using popular research tool to pump out misleading studies
#75[deleted]
Re: Medical students are using popular research tool to pump out misleading studies
#76Earlier quoted context omitted.
This article is about MD doctors, not scientists (although there may be some MD-PhDs in it, and yes MDs can get research positions). MD doctors poll at extraordinarily high levels of trust, over almost any other professional group in the United States. So it really isn't correct to directly link this article's topic to "distrust". The effect you're talking about may exist in science, but this article is essentially a…
MD doctors (and even to a large extent DO doctors nowadays) are philosophically grounded on science. An MD fundamentally practices science. That used to be one of the key differences between MD and DO physicians, but science has been so successful at advancing the standard of care that DOs cannot ignore it anymore. That's just to say that MDs are expected to be fluent in science and it's not some arbitrary expectatio…
Due to the high trust they get from the public, I have run into many MDs who are used to making unfounded assertions with little pushback.
Re: Medical students are using popular research tool to pump out misleading studies
#77As a former scientist it's embarrassing how easily the dismal state of science today could have been predicted decades before by applying Goodhart's Law, or any simple train of thought on incentives and moral hazard. Instead we chose to assume scientists collectively behave on a higher plane. No wonder the general public distrusts "the intelectual elite", we deserved it.
If the solutions are so simple, what are they? Yes, incentives are distorted, but what system - that does not rely on everyone being on a higher plane - would have better incentives?
By your definition, every human endeavor is dismal and always has been - all are corrupted and flawed to some degree. Is there evidence that current science is more dismal than others or than before? You can look at any day in history and see people saying the same things about how it's so dismal and not like the good old days.
> No wonder the general public distrusts "the intelectual elite", we deserved it.
The general public has no idea about scientific publishing, publish or perish, or the distorted incentives it creates. Science has delivered at an incredible level for centuries, arguably more than any other human enterprise. Covid-19 vaccines were available in record time - it wasn't the science that caused it to go somewhat off the rails.
Re: Medical students are using popular research tool to pump out misleading studies
#78I’m currently facing a severe health condition and I can’t help but ask various LLMs about it. They all will eventually offer solutions or avenues that sound promising or ‘easy’ when I know better, that the path ahead of me is hard, however they will non-chalantly offer a path forward they insist will work. The best part is when it cites commercial websites promotional statements as facts, though it will also misinterpret medical journals if I say to restrict itself to that.
In closing, my Redfin escapism has shifted to LLM medical escapism, I know better but if you don’t or you are in even more dire straits, it provides such an illusion of hope and that’s dangerous.
Re: Medical students are using popular research tool to pump out misleading studies
#7990% biomedicine papers are bullshit. These students are just practicing bullshit.
Pretty much extends to 90% of all papers are bullshit. And with all the new bullshit generators we have now, that will probably increase.
Re: Medical students are using popular research tool to pump out misleading studies
#80Earlier quoted context omitted.
MD doctors (and even to a large extent DO doctors nowadays) are philosophically grounded on science. An MD fundamentally practices science. That used to be one of the key differences between MD and DO physicians, but science has been so successful at advancing the standard of care that DOs cannot ignore it anymore. That's just to say that MDs are expected to be fluent in science and it's not some arbitrary expectatio…
Due to the high trust they get from the public, I have run into many MDs who are used to making unfounded assertions with little pushback.
Why is this? MDs are among the people I trust the least, along with lawyers, financial advisors, and real-estate agents.