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'We had to get out of the way': The backlash over delivery robots

bbc.com

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Re: 'We had to get out of the way': The backlash over delivery robots

#71

Post by crote »

Ferret7446 wrote: post #69
skywhopper wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What does this have to do with robots? What does a local government failure to provide cycling infrastructure have to do with private businesses co-opting public shared resources?

There is cycling infrastructure, the cyclists just choose to use pedestrian sidewalks. If cyclists infringing on pedestrian pathways isn't enforced, why should robots infringing on pedestrian pathways be enforced?

Is there actual cycling infrastructure, or is it just a painted line on car infrastructure done in a way that only a suicidal person would use it?

My country has great cycling infrastructure. I never see bikes on the sidewalk. There is a direct link between the two.

Re: 'We had to get out of the way': The backlash over delivery robots

#72

Post by crote »

relyks wrote: post #9

This article captures the problem exactly. In Miami, there are areas where sidewalks are too narrow for a robot (from Serve Robotics) and a human to share simultaneously, so either the robot or the human goes first. If the human wants to go first, they have to step into the street and walk around the robot. The robot and its operator are never courteous enough to back up. Which raises the question: why should these r…

> If the human wants to go first, they have to step into the street and walk around the robot. The robot and its operator are never courteous enough to back up.

Tip them over to make a path. The sidewalk is for humans, the robot is a guest.

Can't program your robots to behave properly? Have fun spending a fortune running after them!

Re: 'We had to get out of the way': The backlash over delivery robots

#73

Post by bluefirebrand »

al_borland wrote: post #51
1shooner wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>regrettably orders a lot from DoorDash I live in a dense urban area where it's easy to walk to get stuff, so that biases my perception, but why do you order from door dash? Is it a time constraint? Unless I was incapacitated or seriously out of time (which, as you say, Door dash doesn't reliably solve for), I can't imagine not walking within the range of these robots.

From what I can find, the delivery radius on these things is about 3 miles. While I have a lot of options in that range, the vast majority of those options are a little over a mile away. So it would probably be a 2.5 miles round trip walk. I’ve done it, but it’s not like living in a dense urban area where I can walk outside and have dozens of options (which I’ve had in the past). My allergies prevent me from wanting…

> I’ve been dealing with a lot of burnout and depression, so the motivation to leave the house is low

I know this isn't the point of your post but I hope you have a good support network to help you through this. Wishing you the best.

Re: 'We had to get out of the way': The backlash over delivery robots

#74

Post by danny_codes »

rcxdude wrote: post #36
devin-2030 wrote: post #23

The argument of proponents used to be that it removes a lot of large vehicles off the street for small local deliveries… yes and onto the sidewalk. Makes no sense.

The density can go up quite a bit when you don't have a car needing to haul itself around.

Or we could build walkable cities so people can, you know, just walk to the restaurant.

Re: 'We had to get out of the way': The backlash over delivery robots

#75

Post by 1shooner »

al_borland wrote: post #51
1shooner wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>regrettably orders a lot from DoorDash I live in a dense urban area where it's easy to walk to get stuff, so that biases my perception, but why do you order from door dash? Is it a time constraint? Unless I was incapacitated or seriously out of time (which, as you say, Door dash doesn't reliably solve for), I can't imagine not walking within the range of these robots.

From what I can find, the delivery radius on these things is about 3 miles. While I have a lot of options in that range, the vast majority of those options are a little over a mile away. So it would probably be a 2.5 miles round trip walk. I’ve done it, but it’s not like living in a dense urban area where I can walk outside and have dozens of options (which I’ve had in the past). My allergies prevent me from wanting…

Sorry to hear that. I have all kinds of interesting stuff literally right outside my door, and WFH hermit mode gets me too sometimes. I've come to believe cars are mental illness machines. When I was at that range, I used to bike places, which was kind of it's own activity apart from where I needed to go, but I know there are many places where that would not reduce hassle or stress.

Re: 'We had to get out of the way': The backlash over delivery robots

#76

Post by danaris »

solid_fuel wrote: post #59
bluefirebrand wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not the city's responsibility to make the sidewalks delivery robot friendly, it's 100% a failure on the part of the robot company

> It's not the city's responsibility to make the sidewalks delivery robot friendly, it's 100% a failure on the part of the robot company I don't expect them to make the sidewalks robot friendly, but I think they are responsible for keeping the sidewalks clear of obstructions - so if the robots are obstructing people in my view the city should remove them and fine the company. Failing to do that would be a failure to…

...The robots aren't (by and large) just sitting there taking up space. They're not something you're going to be able to have a standard city street cleaning crew just pick up and toss in the bin when they go around in the early morning. They're actively scooting around, mostly from midmorning through early evening, because that's when people want to receive deliveries.

Re: 'We had to get out of the way': The backlash over delivery robots

#77

Post by patrick451 »

fouc wrote: post #52
Hizonner wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> They can use the streets proper if they want to. How about no? They'll block traffic there, too.

Vehicles have been far too dominant in city planning, it's probably time to re-prioritize, make it look more like Netherlands or some other European countries perhaps. I suggest a priority order somewhat like: pedestrians > bicyclists > delivery bots > vehicles currently in America I suppose it probably looks more like this currently: vehicles > delivery bots > pedestrians.

The vast majority of Americans prefer roads being dedicated to vehicles. I live in a town that is stealing drivable roadway for bike lanes. It's a total wast of tax dollars. There is never anybody in this bike lanes. Because even in this flaming blue, bike friendly city, people drive because it's just better.

Re: 'We had to get out of the way': The backlash over delivery robots

#78

Post by jurgenburgen »

solid_fuel wrote: post #4

I have a friend who uses a wheelchair and he hates encountering these things in the wild. I know there's a couple different companies making these things and I'm not sure if they all behave like this, but they take up the whole sidewalk and won't backup or turn to get out of the way. Instead they just sit there blinking and beeping at my friend, and of course in a wheelchair it's not easy (or safe!) to go over the cu…

> Instead they just sit there blinking and beeping at my friend, and of course in a wheelchair it's not easy (or safe!) to go over the curb or anything to get around them.

I would keep on rolling into the robot. Sometimes the provider needs some production incidents to get motivated into fixing a bug.

Re: 'We had to get out of the way': The backlash over delivery robots

#79

Post by solid_fuel »

danaris wrote: post #76
solid_fuel wrote: post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It's not the city's responsibility to make the sidewalks delivery robot friendly, it's 100% a failure on the part of the robot company I don't expect them to make the sidewalks robot friendly, but I think they are responsible for keeping the sidewalks clear of obstructions - so if the robots are obstructing people in my view the city should remove them and fine the company. Failing to do that would be a failure to…

...The robots aren't (by and large) just sitting there taking up space. They're not something you're going to be able to have a standard city street cleaning crew just pick up and toss in the bin when they go around in the early morning. They're actively scooting around, mostly from midmorning through early evening, because that's when people want to receive deliveries.

I thought it was obvious but to be extra clear "remove" in this case would mean fining the company and revoking their permits to operate in the city. Not... running around and herding robots into a truck or whatever.

Re: 'We had to get out of the way': The backlash over delivery robots

#80

Post by lesostep »

exmadscientist wrote: post #20
solid_fuel wrote: post #4

I have a friend who uses a wheelchair and he hates encountering these things in the wild. I know there's a couple different companies making these things and I'm not sure if they all behave like this, but they take up the whole sidewalk and won't backup or turn to get out of the way. Instead they just sit there blinking and beeping at my friend, and of course in a wheelchair it's not easy (or safe!) to go over the cu…

Robots that cannot share sidewalks with humans, including humans in wheelchairs, should be banned from sidewalks. Full stop. End of discussion. They can use the streets proper if they want to. I'm sure there is some way to formalize that using ADA sidewalk requirements or something similar.

There should be some some way to sue for unlawful restriction of access to public infrastructure.

As far as I'm aware, you can't just put a border on a sidewalk.

Bots that stop you from using sidewalk are essentially that. A border on a public infrastructure put there by some company.

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