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It used to be hard

praf.me

71–80 of 102 posts

Re: It used to be hard

#71
post #48
post #21

If you're not finding it hard to write software any more, write more ambitious software . I'm taking on massively more ambitious projects than I was just a year ago, and it's taking every inch of my skill and experience to do that. Building software feels harder now, and I'm really enjoying it.

Great as long as you have the flexibility to choose your own projects..

There's never been a better time to be independent of an employer!

Re: It used to be hard

#72
post #63

What type of applications are y'all seeing from LLMs? Anecdotally the only thing that has changed for me is the ability to output more code. That's not software. My coworker is a 10x vibe-coder and his flagship application is held together with brittle shell scripts, a sloppy codebase, bad abstractions, piles of markdown files and an ouroboros of generated tests. This is not software. This is just held together with…

the 0x engineer became a 10x vibe-coder responsible for our CICD and vibe-coded testing that was previously manual He's introduced several 100,000s LoC changes and additions in 10-15 codebases. There are some repos that only he works in ( so no PRs, just merge to master and be done ). He also has self-approved and merged changes without review (he's an admin) Anyway, now he put in his notice and no one on his team kn…

Hah, ultimate vibe coder nightmare scenario. I wonder if, in six months time, there will be enough stories like this for sanity to prevail a little more.

Re: It used to be hard

#73

> Turning this essay into a song in the style of 2000's Hip Hop? It used to be hard Have you listened to the song he links? It's very convincing. If you were just casually listening to it in the grocery store, you wouldn't notice it was made by AI.

[deleted]

Re: It used to be hard

#74
post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Very convincing indeed! I really want to know what AI made that, as I’m looking forward to creating personal/customized music in a similar way.

almost certainly suno

Yeah it was Suno, it's in the MP3 metadata on https://www.praf.me/audio/used-to-be-hard.mp3 :

  "tags": {
    "title": "Kubernetes Roofspin",
    "artist": "prafff",
    "comment": "made with suno; created=2026-06-08T23:11:09.140Z; id=793ca281-38c3-4cfd-96d3-ad3e82a46157",
Accessed with:

  ffprobe -v quiet -print_format json -show_format -show_streams used-to-be-hard.mp3
Full output here: https://gist.github.com/simonw/f4d82c38bad0879acfcf54bd8e61a... - turns out Suno embeds the lyrics in the metadata as well.

Re: It used to be hard

#75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Interesting - I’ve been thinking that when people say “writing code” they mean figuring out abstractions, logic, reasoning. Without that, what’s left? The syntax? Realizing we might not all have the same thing in mind when someone says “writing code was never hard/easy” is making a lot of other comments I’ve read here make more sense!

Writing code, IMO, is mostly the typing. AKA the syntax and whatever libraries/platforms you’re using. They are incidental to creating a software solution to whatever problems. It requires rigor, but it’s not particularly difficult. Abstractions, logic, and reasoning is not helped by AI tools. Yes they can give you a ready-made solution, but you’ll need to exercise judgement to see if it really fits the problem. And…

I would agree with that. Whenever I’ve delegated more than what feels like ~80% to the agent (“vibe coding”, I suppose) is when it starts feeling bloated, messy, and bug-prone.

On the flip side, having a design written ahead of time, ideally with reviews by peers and AI and as little as possible AI “content”, seems to almost always go well.

Obviously very subjective!

Re: It used to be hard

#76
post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

People in the know are not suggesting engineers are no longer needed, but that they need to adapt.

Please explain this "adapting". The LLM sellers' holygrail is * you just need to crank our model bro *. With this mindset, there is no adaptation needed, save a couple of weeks of getting up to speed with nuances of using the models, the / commands and integration of their APIs into your workflow.

You gotta ignore what the LLM sellers are saying and listen to the people who don't have a financial incentive to sell a particular message.

Re: It used to be hard

#77
post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't disagree, and I've heard this said a bunch, but to some degree it feels like cope. Writing code wasn't generally the barrier to success, but it was still a barrier. And for sure, it's not gone entirely, but in a way it was one of the fun parts, and it does feel like a big part of it is gone now. Many of us have nostalgic memories about staying up late, in the zone, cranking out code until you manage to get so…

I don’t think writing code was ever hard. It’s basically the same level of difficulty as learning to write sheet music, a foreign language, or mathematical formula. Same with basic computer concepts. The hardest part is the formal logic, recursive reasoning, and how to abstract. It’s a thinking mode that some find difficult to adopt. As for domain knowledge, I don’t think that has ever been difficult to obtain. Just…

> It’s basically the same level of difficulty as learning to write sheet music, a foreign language, or mathematical formula.

I mean, all of those are pretty dang hard. Maybe you're just particularly skilled (genuinely, no shade intended), I certainly couldn't do any of those without a significant level of effort.

I'd also personally consider "formal logic, recursive reasoning, and how to abstract" as parts of writing code, as the other commenter said. And while AI certainly isn't at the point of "solving" those yet, it's a heck of a lot closer than we were a few years ago.

And sure, you can always obtain domain knowledge, but the whole point of knowing it is that you can see approaches other might not, answer questions quickly, etc. And a lot of this is still relevant post-AI, but it does feel like a lot of it has been lost. It feels like implying that search engines weren't a major upgrade to research because you could always just go to the library and look through books to find your answer - sure, but googling a question is a lot easier! And chatbots just feel like an upgrade from that.

Re: It used to be hard

#78

What type of applications are y'all seeing from LLMs? Anecdotally the only thing that has changed for me is the ability to output more code. That's not software. My coworker is a 10x vibe-coder and his flagship application is held together with brittle shell scripts, a sloppy codebase, bad abstractions, piles of markdown files and an ouroboros of generated tests. This is not software. This is just held together with…

> brittle shell scripts, a sloppy codebase, bad abstractions, piles of markdown files and an ouroboros of generated tests. This is not software

I think that's software. It's not good software, but it's software.

This perspective feels a bit like a chef insisting McDonalds or frozen dinners aren't food. It's mass produced, unoriginal, and typically soulless, but it's still food. As Scott would say, maybe a map vs territory discussion.

Re: It used to be hard

#79
post #21

If you're not finding it hard to write software any more, write more ambitious software . I'm taking on massively more ambitious projects than I was just a year ago, and it's taking every inch of my skill and experience to do that. Building software feels harder now, and I'm really enjoying it.

[deleted]

Re: It used to be hard

#80

What type of applications are y'all seeing from LLMs? Anecdotally the only thing that has changed for me is the ability to output more code. That's not software. My coworker is a 10x vibe-coder and his flagship application is held together with brittle shell scripts, a sloppy codebase, bad abstractions, piles of markdown files and an ouroboros of generated tests. This is not software. This is just held together with…

> brittle shell scripts, a sloppy codebase, bad abstractions, piles of markdown files and an ouroboros of generated tests. This is not software I think that's software. It's not good software, but it's software. This perspective feels a bit like a chef insisting McDonalds or frozen dinners aren't food. It's mass produced, unoriginal, and typically soulless, but it's still food. As Scott would say, maybe a map vs terr…

I don't know if Fast Food is a good example to be using here, because it is pretty unambiguously bad for us
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