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Ferrari shares fall after launch of first EV as Jony Ive design proves divisive

theguardian.com

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Re: Ferrari shares fall after launch of first EV as Jony Ive design proves divisive

#71

Post by davey48016 »

mysterydip wrote: post #64
cbdevidal wrote: post #14

What prevents car manufacturers from taking a normal-looking body style and electrifying it? Seems popular with the aftermarket mods. Every hybrid and EV I can think of looks like a suppository. Edit: I asked AI the same question and it reminded me that BMW’s i4, Camry Hybrid, Porsche Taycan, Ferrari 296 GTB (hybrid), Corvette E-Ray, F150 Lightning, and Genesis Electrified G80 all look fairly similar to standard ICE…

Ironically, I think your question is the reason it’s not done more often, or at least some brands make “very obvious” EV’s: because for some customers, they want people to know they’re different (and memorable) from the ICE vehicles.

I wonder if that was mostly true of early adopters, and more mainstream consumers would prefer more conventional designs.

Re: Ferrari shares fall after launch of first EV as Jony Ive design proves divisive

#72

Post by hyperhello »

beAbU wrote: post #68
xnx wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> the "Magic mouse" of ferraris Could be worse. Could be the 1998 iMac mouse of cars. (No way to tell which way it's going.)

I posit that a mouse that needs to be on its back to be charged, thus rendering it completely useless during that time, to be much much much worse than a round mouse with no immediate indication which way is forward...

It takes a half hour to get months of charge back, so it’s not a functional problem. I think you wanted to have a wireless mouse with a port in the back so it feels like a wired mouse when you want it to. That would have been cool but I suspect a standard usb cable wouldn’t be rated for being continually contorted and wouldn’t be as pleasant as a wired mouse wire designed for that, so you’d need a special wire and it was just not going to work.

Re: Ferrari shares fall after launch of first EV as Jony Ive design proves divisive

#73

Post by ShinyLeftPad »

nerdjon wrote: post #47

As someone who is not in the market for a Ferrari, I feel like I am crazy for actually kinda liking the look of it? (The blue is bad, they should have used the red one for all of the marketing) I mean, I feel like it should be a departure from the Ferrari look since it really isn't one that fits the expectation of what a Ferrari is. It feels like this is more an expansion of the Ferrari brand into a new segment while…

> if it did try to look like a normal Ferrari but then it didn't feel, sound, etc like one due to being Electric people would also complain

A "normal" Ferrari or any old sportscar looks cool on a race track but in real life it is literally midlife crisis on wheels, very awkward and out of place. I always feel pity/judgement when I see one. I heard it's also uncomfortable for passengers in the back and so on.

Form is function. Making this car look like something it isn't just for the sake of legacy appearance would be top engineering stupidity and waste. And trying to compete with your own ICE cars at what they are best also would not be so smart business-wise.

I'm not a car guy but this car seems to be doing something totally new for Ferrari. If there was no controversy THEN it would be worrying!

Re: Ferrari shares fall after launch of first EV as Jony Ive design proves divisive

#74

Post by NewJazz »

ShinyLeftPad wrote: post #31
ortusdux wrote: post #9

Marques Brownlee toured one recently - "Ferrari Luce is the Most Controversial Ferrari Ever" https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6Reu1WS3BhM

Thanks for the link. Totally seeing the appeal of this car. The UX seems actually very good (based on this short review so far). Good use of physical tactile controls + flexibility of a screen. As to external looks. Whenever I see old ICE sports cars (all those lotuses, ferraris, lamborghinis) they seem so awkward and out of place on city streets. They just scream midlife crisis. I think this will be an upgrade in th…

Yeah but why would anyone pay $600k for a car just to not look like they are having a midlife crisis?

Re: Ferrari shares fall after launch of first EV as Jony Ive design proves divisive

#75

Post by plqbfbv »

cbdevidal wrote: post #14

What prevents car manufacturers from taking a normal-looking body style and electrifying it? Seems popular with the aftermarket mods. Every hybrid and EV I can think of looks like a suppository. Edit: I asked AI the same question and it reminded me that BMW’s i4, Camry Hybrid, Porsche Taycan, Ferrari 296 GTB (hybrid), Corvette E-Ray, F150 Lightning, and Genesis Electrified G80 all look fairly similar to standard ICE…

> What prevents car manufacturers from taking a normal-looking body style and electrifying it? Seems popular with the aftermarket mods. Every hybrid and EV I can think of looks like a suppository.

The fact that even though an ICE engine is only 35% efficient, the energy density of fuel is still much higher than gas. Gasoline is 50x more energy-dense than an average EV lithium battery (taking a Tesla Model 3 as example). That's why you can fuel 9L of gasoline or charge and carry around ~500kg of batteries for the same range.

So in order to make the car efficient and travel 500km you have to bend the shape to be as aerodynamic as possible. That's where retractile/flush handles also come from, it wasn't just a gimmick or wow-factor on the Model S when it launched. It's still like that years later on all models because it still makes the car more efficient.

The research and push for higher densities is finally starting to pay off, so in time less efficient but more appealing/classic designs may start to emerge again, because you're less constrained by how much energy you can carry per same weight/volume.

Re: Ferrari shares fall after launch of first EV as Jony Ive design proves divisive

#76

Post by johnwalkr »

I don't think this looks bad but I think this will look dated very fast. The exterior looks like a continuation of the last 20 years of car designs in general, not an update to Ferrari design. An exception is the rear-end which is a good take on the F40's rear end. A larger nod to older designs, like the modern Dodge Challenger or Ford Bronco would be nice to see. I'm sure if you talk to Jony Ive he will explain the Ferrari inspiration behind each subtle curve but it is not obviously a Ferrari at a glance.

On the other hand, it's a five-seater and an attempt to make it look more like Ferrari's iconic cars could also end badly.

The interior and interfaces look great. Even if the roundness of interior is not your cup of tea, figuring out the right balance between tactile buttons and touchscreen is really important and they might have nailed it.

Re: Ferrari shares fall after launch of first EV as Jony Ive design proves divisive

#78

Post by ShinyLeftPad »

NewJazz wrote: post #74
ShinyLeftPad wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Thanks for the link. Totally seeing the appeal of this car. The UX seems actually very good (based on this short review so far). Good use of physical tactile controls + flexibility of a screen. As to external looks. Whenever I see old ICE sports cars (all those lotuses, ferraris, lamborghinis) they seem so awkward and out of place on city streets. They just scream midlife crisis. I think this will be an upgrade in th…

Yeah but why would anyone pay $600k for a car just to not look like they are having a midlife crisis?

Some people exist in another financial dimension :shrug: Bentleys and rolls royces for example don't scream midlife crisis and this is a bit closer to that by comfort apparently

Re: Ferrari shares fall after launch of first EV as Jony Ive design proves divisive

#79

Post by dui0828 »

laserlight wrote: post #48
robertnowell wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

imo the exterior looks like a cartoon BYD and should be killed with fire. however while folks are negative on Ive for the car shape, he only designed the interiors not the car body, and the interiors are kinda lovely car interior design: -no touchscreen (dangerous while driving) -clicky, intuitive tactile switches and buttons -thoughtful use of color (display base color changes based on driving mode) I mean even just…

> he only designed the interiors not the car body TopGear reports otherwise [0]: > In a genius move, they hired design agency LoveFrom to handle the exterior and interior execution: that’s headed by former Apple chief design officer, Sir Jonathan Ive. [0] https://www.topgear.com/car-news/electric/its-finally-here-m...

Thanks for sharing this!

Re: Ferrari shares fall after launch of first EV as Jony Ive design proves divisive

#80

Post by UebVar »

mysterydip wrote: post #64
cbdevidal wrote: post #14

What prevents car manufacturers from taking a normal-looking body style and electrifying it? Seems popular with the aftermarket mods. Every hybrid and EV I can think of looks like a suppository. Edit: I asked AI the same question and it reminded me that BMW’s i4, Camry Hybrid, Porsche Taycan, Ferrari 296 GTB (hybrid), Corvette E-Ray, F150 Lightning, and Genesis Electrified G80 all look fairly similar to standard ICE…

Ironically, I think your question is the reason it’s not done more often, or at least some brands make “very obvious” EV’s: because for some customers, they want people to know they’re different (and memorable) from the ICE vehicles.

I think this is a meme in marketing departments, but not actually true.

For the longest time ICE car makers build cars that screamed "electric". They mostly where behind expectations. At that time the by far most successful EV brand was Tesla with the USP that their cars looked like cars, while the EV from the competition looked like video game asserts; the BMW EVs from that time where among the most ugly cars i have ever seen.

Now this has reversed. The current EVs from VW, Mercedes and BMW, Renault, Dacia, Fiat all look normal. The ordinary-looking BMW iX3 has a long waiting list since launch, VWs boring ID-cars are doing better than ever. Tesla has released the cybertruck that screams "electric" and is a sales disaster.

My personal conspiracy theory is that the ICE divisions wanted to prevent EVs cannibalizing their market and they pushed for ugliness or "differentiation".

People want cars to look like cars. This is tautologically true, but manufactures needed quite some time to figure that out.

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