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BambuStudio has been violating PrusaSlicer AGPL license since their fork

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Re: BambuStudio has been violating PrusaSlicer AGPL license since their fork

#71

Post by awkwardpotato »

My_Name wrote: post #33

I use my printer to make prototypes for my business. There is no way in hell I'm sending them into the internet for some random to examine. I think my next printer will be mostly 3D printed, with a few generic parts like motor controllers, the odd bit of metal tubing, off the shelf bed levelling system, open source software etc. I only need single colour prints for work, and AFAIK the fastest printer on the planet is…

> I think my next printer will be mostly 3D printed

What you're looking for then is a Voron. They're the printers that Bambu was "inspired" by and are made with all off-the-shelf parts.

I really enjoyed building my Voron 2.4. I bought a kit that included all the wires pre-harnessed which made it much simpler to do.

Re: BambuStudio has been violating PrusaSlicer AGPL license since their fork

#72

Post by xyzzy_plugh »

I don't like all this shaming on social media. It feels performative and leaves a bad taste in my mouth.

If they're in violation of your copyright agreements, sue them. If you can't sue them because it's unenforceable, well, that sucks, but too bad.

I don't know what they expect to happen here. Is there even a clear call to action? Boycott? Do something.

Re: BambuStudio has been violating PrusaSlicer AGPL license since their fork

#73

Post by embedding-shape »

xyzzy_plugh wrote: post #72

I don't like all this shaming on social media. It feels performative and leaves a bad taste in my mouth. If they're in violation of your copyright agreements, sue them. If you can't sue them because it's unenforceable, well, that sucks, but too bad. I don't know what they expect to happen here. Is there even a clear call to action? Boycott? Do something .

I think the courts are so inefficient, not to mention limited to single countries, that huge "social protests" like this seems more efficient if you actually want to see some change, rather than the year-long process of going through the courts.

I do agree with you though, that every time these things happen I also get a somewhat sour taste in my mouth. Ideally there'd be better venues for things like this, but based on history it seems to be the most effective way, sadly.

Re: BambuStudio has been violating PrusaSlicer AGPL license since their fork

#74

Post by kennywinker »

xyzzy_plugh wrote: post #72

I don't like all this shaming on social media. It feels performative and leaves a bad taste in my mouth. If they're in violation of your copyright agreements, sue them. If you can't sue them because it's unenforceable, well, that sucks, but too bad. I don't know what they expect to happen here. Is there even a clear call to action? Boycott? Do something .

> Back then we considered legal action. We seriously did. But the practical reality: PrusaSlicer is software, not hardware. There's no boxed product crossing customs to stop - only real possibility which would make them comply. And jurisdiction for the licensee lands in China, which means the case lands in a Chinese court applying Chinese law to a Chinese company.

If there is no legal recourse, but you believe in the ideas and philosophy of copyleft, then all that is left is social enforcement. I.e. don’t buy their printers and tell your friends not to buy their printers.

But you seem to have a problem with that second part because it’s “performative”? Ok…

Or is it just that you’d rather the call to action was clearer? Because it’s pretty clear to me.

Re: BambuStudio has been violating PrusaSlicer AGPL license since their fork

#76

Post by kennywinker »

My_Name wrote: post #33

I use my printer to make prototypes for my business. There is no way in hell I'm sending them into the internet for some random to examine. I think my next printer will be mostly 3D printed, with a few generic parts like motor controllers, the odd bit of metal tubing, off the shelf bed levelling system, open source software etc. I only need single colour prints for work, and AFAIK the fastest printer on the planet is…

There are options, albeit chinese, that don’t phone home. I have a qidi q2 that’s an awesome printer, and runs open firmware (klipper+fluid) and is pretty much a voron with closed-source hardware, or an x1c with open software. I’m told flashforge printers, the current new hotness because of its multi-nozzle printing, are pretty much open as well.

Re: BambuStudio has been violating PrusaSlicer AGPL license since their fork

#77

Post by embedding-shape »

nik282000 wrote: post #70
Renaud wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not everything that a Chinese company does is for nefarious reason or under the hidden agenda of the Chinese government. The reality is much more mundane: many Chinese companies do not understand the expectations around open source. There isn’t anything really equivalent in China. The closest mindset is that things that are available to use, are available to take. The notion of copyright -while not inexistent- is not…

> The reality is much more mundane: many Chinese companies do not understand the expectations around open source. Except that Bambu is not a small player in the game, and they made threats of using the DMCA which shows they are fully aware of "western" IP law and the nature of licenses, Open or otherwise.

Aren't you saying the same thing as parent? The expectation is usually NOT to send DMCA notices, so if they do, doesn't that also allude to what parent said, that they don't understand the expectations around open source?

Re: BambuStudio has been violating PrusaSlicer AGPL license since their fork

#78

Post by kennywinker »

jazzyjackson wrote: post #50
tjoff wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Or, just maybe, buy a printer that does not actively disrespect their users?

I guess it depends on what you value more highly, a machine from a company that respects intellectual property, or a machine that reliably prints parts without intervention.

This was true a couple years ago, but the other vendors have caught up. Today you have options that reliably print without intervention and aren’t bambus

Re: BambuStudio has been violating PrusaSlicer AGPL license since their fork

#79

Post by baby_souffle »

avianlyric wrote: post #63
lnenad wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think you're overestimate the value of these prototypes. The print itself is either a plastic render of the final product without any value, or it's a shell without any actual useful parts/machinery. If we imagine we're talking about the 1% of 1% of 1% which could end up as useful IP stuff, but which might be very hard/impossible to find/understand/do anything with it, for which cases don't use bambu.

You’re making the assumption that customer product prototypes are the only prototypes produced by 3D printers. There’s plenty of other more valuable things that are prototyped using 3D printers, such as high end commercial machines, or components that go into those machines. I suspect that getting hold of STLs from US defence manufacturers would be extremely valuable. Why bother trying to capture a copy of your enemi…

> I suspect that getting hold of STLs from US defence manufacturers would be extremely valuable

It would be, yes. There’s a reason why Prussia has optional connectivity and the camera can be physically removed and unplugged.

Re: BambuStudio has been violating PrusaSlicer AGPL license since their fork

#80

Post by rileymat2 »

doginasuit wrote: post #37
pocksuppet wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Copyleft is about freedom of consumers to make whatever choice fits their target, unlike permissive licensing, which is about freedom of corporations to take away freedom of consumers.

Surprisingly, there are use-cases for closed source other than the of greed of corporations. A server is one of those use-cases. I love to see open source servers and have worked on them myself but there are obvious reasons why that is not always feasible.

Greed is a loaded word, there are economic realities of paying developers to create the open source software. Could you elaborate on the non-economic use cases you are thinking of?
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