71–80 of 420 posts
Earlier quoted context omitted.
GitHub is free.
User publishes to github => Copilot trains with GitHub data => MS Sells copilot => User workes for Microsoft (in the sense of giving it's labour for MS to make money) User publishes to github => Deepseek trains with GitHub data => Deepseek gives model away for free => User did not work for Deepseek (in the sense of giving it's labour for Deepseek to make money)
I'm surprised that people here don't care at all about these models openly training on your data, especially if you use them straight from the model developer. Whereas things like "GitHub now automatically opts everyone into using their code for model training" get hundreds of justifiably angry comments, I never see this brought up anymore on posts like these talking about using Chinese models through OpenRouter. Thi…
As opposed to? Do you really think OpenAI, Anthropic or any other entity in the same business respects your data? The Chinese AI companies who release open weights actually deserve whatever input you give them. They are the reason why there is competition and not duopolies in the domain.
OpenAI, I wouldn't be surprised if you were right.
I'm surprised that people here don't care at all about these models openly training on your data, especially if you use them straight from the model developer. Whereas things like "GitHub now automatically opts everyone into using their code for model training" get hundreds of justifiably angry comments, I never see this brought up anymore on posts like these talking about using Chinese models through OpenRouter. Thi…
You definitely have a bone to pick. Chinese researchers usually have given the world the most cheap and consistent high quality research around LLMs. They don't pretend, they do the work and release the goodies. Mostly so cheap, every one in the world has a chance to use close to frontier models. Why would you respond with "Anger"? You let us know what your real complaint is about and let's not feign indignation at o…
I'm not sure I'd call it "almost on the frontier," but I do think that v4 Pro is the most usable coding model I've seen out of China. I've used it via Ollama Cloud (coding) and OpenRouter (data processing). Feels Sonnet-level to me -- solid at implementation when given a specification, but falls a good bit short of Opus 4.7 max thinking when planning out larger changes or when given open-ended prompts.
While the cost are lower than frontier models there are two factors that make DS4 Pro and K2.6 not as cheap as they might look. For DS4 Pro there's a discount going on for the official API, which sometimes gets overlooked and mixed up in discussions. Simon uses the full price in the comparison, so that's not an issue here. The other issue is that DS4 Pro and K2.6 often use way more reasoning tokens than the frontier…
I had attempted this with Opus 4.6 in the past and it burned through the $10 budget I’d given it before it returned from my initial prompt.
Even if it’s heavily discounted, it would still have cost me single digits for a complete solution vs double-digits for exactly nothing.
I've been using v4 pro for the past few days and honestly in terms of quality it seems more or less on par with open AIs 5.4 or opus 4.6 (i havent tried 4.7) To be clear, i'm not doing state of the art stuff. I mostly used it for frontend development since i'm not great at that and just need a decent looking prototype. But for my purposes it's a perfectly good model, and the price is decent. I can't wait for open mod…
Disclaimer I'm the cofounder. This works by running the model inside a secure enclave (using NVIDIA confidential computing) and verifying the open source code running inside the enclave matches the runtime attestation. The docs walk you through the verification process: https://docs.tinfoil.sh/verification/verification-in-tinfoil
The V3/R1 time and now are in such contrast. V3/R1 were hyped hard and barely usable for coding. V4 is much less hyped but (anecdotally) it has completely demolished all the Flash/Lite/Spark models.
I tried deepseek v4 through open code at the weekend. I'm a daily Claude/Claude code user. I tried to build something simple and while it got the job done the thinking displayed did not fill me with confidence. It was pages and pages of "actually no", "hang on", "wait that makes no sense". It was like the model was having a breakdown. Bear in mind open code was also new to me so I could be just seeing thinking where…
I'm not sure I'd call it "almost on the frontier," but I do think that v4 Pro is the most usable coding model I've seen out of China. I've used it via Ollama Cloud (coding) and OpenRouter (data processing). Feels Sonnet-level to me -- solid at implementation when given a specification, but falls a good bit short of Opus 4.7 max thinking when planning out larger changes or when given open-ended prompts.
Have you given GLM 5.1 or Kimi K2.6 a shot for coding? They outperform Deepseek v4 pro.
I think this probably depends quite a bit on the specific problem. I'm finding that Deepseek v4 Flash often outdoes Kimi 2.6 on a variety of coding problems that involve complex spatial reasoning