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The AI Layoff Trap

arxiv.org

71–80 of 107 posts

Re: The AI Layoff Trap

#71
post #41
post #13

I use AIs for coding with moderate success, but the more I work with them, the more I am convinced that "intelligence on tap" is a pipe dream, especially in domains where logical thinking in novel (ie not-in-dataset) contexts is required. Recently, I tasked it to study a new Czech building permit law in conjunction with some waste disposal regulations and the result was just tragic. The model (opus 4.6) just could no…

I wonder what percentage of the job space truly depends on the current edge we have over machines. I think it's reasonable to worry that way before machines are more reliable than the average human (let alone more reliable than a highly trained human) they can pose a significant disruption to the job market which will send shockwaves throughout society

That is why we need functioning states -- free markets won't save you in such a case. Though I found it is hard to explain especially to U.S. people, who put "regulation" on par with f words :)

Re: The AI Layoff Trap

#72

Still looking for the AI in the room. Where is it exactly? Surely nobody is claiming LLMs are AI?

Doing the translations and asset creations for CMS content, that used to be done previously by human teams, for example.

Re: The AI Layoff Trap

#73

The trick is bypassing the human consumer as well. Companies satisfy (human) consumer needs as a byproduct of profit maximization. But human consumers are inefficient. They have to sleep, require medical care, etc. A purely machine economy would be far more efficient. Therefore in the limit we should eliminate reliance on human labor and consumption to build a more perfect and efficient world.

Idea! Maybe these now redundant humans can be turned into a kind of battery, so they serve as a source of energy for the machines? Perhaps it's then smart to make the humans have a brain/computer interface, to make then dream/think they are living in a normal society so they don't revolt.

Agents everywhere!!

Do you like what I've done with the place?

Re: The AI Layoff Trap

#74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Isn’t this more a function of how the American construction market is just really messed up somehow (corruption?)? In China, actual things get built fairly cheaply and quickly. You just don’t see workers hanging around watching one guy dig a hole like you do in the states. I would guess that automation is the only way out of the mess we are in, since just throwing more money and people at the problem just seems to ma…

Could you expand on the corruption claim?

n = 1 …

Go to Miami, Florida, and see how virtually all public projects magically go to Cuban-American-owned companies — even huge multinationals with far greater skill, capacity, and efficiencies can't seem to land the good work.

Re: The AI Layoff Trap

#75

If AI displaces human workers faster than the economy can reabsorb them, it risks eroding the very consumer demand firms depend on. That is a huge "if" though. I am not sure either that the latter falls from this. When the US transitioned away from assembly lines or agriculture dominated, it's not as if consumer spending consequently collapsed.

When did the US transition away from agriculture? When did the US transition away from assembly lines? I don’t think you have thought through either one of these and I don’t think they are comparable to what we expect to see for AI’s changes to the job market.

here is the data. Farming as a percentage of the labor force fell considerably https://blogger.googleusercontent.com/img/b/R29vZ2xl/AVvXsEi...

Re: The AI Layoff Trap

#76
post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Get where faster? Get what over with? Aren’t you talking about destroying livelihoods? Pushing people into poverty and/or homelessness? What is the benefit exactly?

I guess the argument would go that a new economic model will be required at that stage. There isn't much point in having people do jobs they don't like which are trivial to automate just for money, but at the point where there isn't enough economically useful things for everyone to do, the current system falls down. > What is the benefit exactly? Well one benefit would be international competitiveness. The country th…

> but at the point where there isn't enough economically useful things for everyone to do

This assumes that for example a person who has been an artist for 20 years, can easily enough switch professions to a machinist, and the only reason for them not to do it is because the economy has no need for another machinist. An insane way to think. This is not how humans work.

Let me see any HN dweller go from their cushy home office to butchering animals for meat on 12-hour shifts for example... Oh and btw, no safety net to give you food, housing and healthcare while you learn the new craft!

Re: The AI Layoff Trap

#77

neo-luddism dressed up in economic jargon. the authors suggest the only effective tool is to tax companies based on how much automation they achieve. Penalizing efficiency is a guaranteed recipe for stagnation and if we'd done this at any point in our past we would have not made it out of the dark ages

You haven't thought this through.

Re: The AI Layoff Trap

#78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Isn’t this more a function of how the American construction market is just really messed up somehow (corruption?)? In China, actual things get built fairly cheaply and quickly. You just don’t see workers hanging around watching one guy dig a hole like you do in the states. I would guess that automation is the only way out of the mess we are in, since just throwing more money and people at the problem just seems to ma…

What’s different about the market in China that enables this?

The usual answer is slave labor, like in the middle east. But some combination of an extremely poor job market with laborers that can't leave, and can't do anything else.

Re: The AI Layoff Trap

#79
post #25

The trick is bypassing the human consumer as well. Companies satisfy (human) consumer needs as a byproduct of profit maximization. But human consumers are inefficient. They have to sleep, require medical care, etc. A purely machine economy would be far more efficient. Therefore in the limit we should eliminate reliance on human labor and consumption to build a more perfect and efficient world.

The humans consume to fulfill needs, how do those needs get fulfilled in a post human economy?

Large populations of humans not getting their basic needs fulfilled is a feature. That way, those who do have lots of resources get to have even more intense feelings of superiority and that of having high status. That is, after all, the point of wealth accumulation (at least a certain point where more money does not change your life quality meaningfully). For status, its the delta between you and others that matters most. If raising your own wealth has diminishing quality of life returns, then lowering other peoples is the only effective way of increasing the delta.

Re: The AI Layoff Trap

#80

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So you work in one of these fields, right? Hydroponics, homebuilding, theatre construction, pothole repair?

I currently work as a software engineer, but I've worked in the past in restaurants (dishwasher/prep cook), doordashing, as a musician, as moving help. If AI automates software I'll just do something else.

Spoken like a 2007 bond trader
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