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How BYD got EV chargers to work almost as fast as gas pumps

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Re: How BYD got EV chargers to work almost as fast as gas pumps

#71

Post by himata4113 »

giwook wrote: post #37
himata4113 wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I mean if you really think about it china already has or is on the verge of: - energy independence - ASML level microchip production - the SOTA of AI - citizens that accept surveilence and lack of privacy - strong local manufacturing - eastern world support - yuan recognized as a stable world currency But they do suffer from issues as well: - Aging population - Autocracy (or well, one party system) - Brain drain (bet…

> citizens that accept surveilence and lack of privacy It's certainly not to China's extent, but is America really that opposed to surveillance and lack of privacy? Yes, we tend to raise a huge stink when evidence of such comes to the surface. But actions speak louder than words, and through our actions we already largely accept surveillance and a lack of privacy. Everyday consumer apps are some of the worst offender…

The american government pretends to care, but the moment you look deeper (snowden leaks), it's clear that they don't. But the fact still stands, the population is mostly against surveilance while chinese just keep their head down.

Re: How BYD got EV chargers to work almost as fast as gas pumps

#72

Post by Toutouxc »

ekr wrote: post #54

Although the thought of getting an electric car has passed through my mind on a few occasions, I'm not 100% familiar with the intricate technical details. (for some reason, the tax incentives where I live are still in favor of continuing with the small petrol car I have. Taxes are primarily a function of weight in the Netherlands, and anything besides a lightweight Dacia Spring would imply significantly higher monthl…

I believe you meant to write “10S” instead of 10p. I’m not 100% sure, but you were talking about e-bike batteries, which are often 36V, made out of 10 cells (or banks of cells) in series. The nominal voltage of most lithium chemistries is 3.6-3.7V.

EV batteries have many more cells in series, for example my car is 104S, and 800V cars have (obviously) more than 200 cells in series.

And the longevity of car batteries isn’t about wear being distributed “evenly” (a healthy battery can’t really wear “unevenly”, you always load all cells at once). EVs take care of their batteries, they cool them, heat them, balance them periodically, and they don’t actually pull that much power from them. They also keep the cells within pretty conservative voltage limits.

Re: How BYD got EV chargers to work almost as fast as gas pumps

#73

Post by raw_anon_1111 »

shaneos wrote: post #26
est wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> citizens that accept surveilence and lack of privacy citizens had no choice.

Citizens always have a choice. The cost can be terrible, but there’s always a choice

What is that “choice”? Surely you aren’t like those yokels in the south that think a “militia” running in the woods can take on the the US military or even a decent SWAT force

Re: How BYD got EV chargers to work almost as fast as gas pumps

#74

Post by ZeroGravitas »

Tade0 wrote: post #60

I have a feeling that half the reason they're doing this is that they don't have a good idea how to increase energy efficiency. Case in point: 2026 BMW i3 - 900km WLTP from a 108kWh battery. 2026 Denza Z9 GT - 800km WLTP from a 122kWh pack. The former charges at a maximum of 400kW, while the latter at over twice that which saves... about 10 minutes at the charger after 450km of driving(12 vs 22 minutes approx). Many…

This is an NMC vs LFP battery comparison.

They have different trade-offs but LFP is gradually taking over from the bottom of the market and heading up market in a classic disruptive manner.

They are heavier but cheaper and safer and better longevity.

Re: How BYD got EV chargers to work almost as fast as gas pumps

#75

Post by giwook »

himata4113 wrote: post #71
giwook wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> citizens that accept surveilence and lack of privacy It's certainly not to China's extent, but is America really that opposed to surveillance and lack of privacy? Yes, we tend to raise a huge stink when evidence of such comes to the surface. But actions speak louder than words, and through our actions we already largely accept surveillance and a lack of privacy. Everyday consumer apps are some of the worst offender…

The american government pretends to care, but the moment you look deeper (snowden leaks), it's clear that they don't. But the fact still stands, the population is mostly against surveilance while chinese just keep their head down.

They have to keep their head down for fear it will get cut off (figuratively speaking, mostly). I doubt the majority of Chinese civilians are happy to be in a repressed state such as the one they're in.

And unfortunately it's pretty clear the current administration is working hard to enact a similar chilling effect on free speech. It's hard to see how we avoid becoming a similarly surveilled and repressed state if there were a third term.

Re: How BYD got EV chargers to work almost as fast as gas pumps

#76

Post by mikestew »

philipallstar wrote: post #19
ck2 wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

I think you'd have to be a bit ignorant of very recent history to think that America is some cesspool of lack of innovation in the electric car industry. They invented it, despite there being no competition at the time.

In “recent history”, America invented EVs, and there was no competition? What kind of revisionist crap is that? Or am I just misreading your comment?

Re: How BYD got EV chargers to work almost as fast as gas pumps

#77

Post by himata4113 »

giwook wrote: post #75
himata4113 wrote: post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The american government pretends to care, but the moment you look deeper (snowden leaks), it's clear that they don't. But the fact still stands, the population is mostly against surveilance while chinese just keep their head down.

They have to keep their head down for fear it will get cut off (figuratively speaking, mostly). I doubt the majority of Chinese civilians are happy to be in a repressed state such as the one they're in. And unfortunately it's pretty clear the current administration is working hard to enact a similar chilling effect on free speech. It's hard to see how we avoid becoming a similarly surveilled and repressed state if th…

I mean I didn't say it was a good thing. It's a benefit (to the government) that it is already widespread and accepted as part of life.

Re: How BYD got EV chargers to work almost as fast as gas pumps

#78

Post by ekr »

Toutouxc wrote: post #72
ekr wrote: post #54

Although the thought of getting an electric car has passed through my mind on a few occasions, I'm not 100% familiar with the intricate technical details. (for some reason, the tax incentives where I live are still in favor of continuing with the small petrol car I have. Taxes are primarily a function of weight in the Netherlands, and anything besides a lightweight Dacia Spring would imply significantly higher monthl…

I believe you meant to write “10S” instead of 10p. I’m not 100% sure, but you were talking about e-bike batteries, which are often 36V, made out of 10 cells (or banks of cells) in series. The nominal voltage of most lithium chemistries is 3.6-3.7V. EV batteries have many more cells in series, for example my car is 104S, and 800V cars have (obviously) more than 200 cells in series. And the longevity of car batteries i…

Indeed, I meant 10S. And what I meant by load being distributed along more cells, is that since you have many more cells, current drawn from each is lower. Which greatly prolongs the lifetime.

And hence the question I had with charging too fast. Since discharging faster clearly wears them more quickly, surely charging faster has a similar effect, since it's mostly the reversed process? A question probably easily answered with a query to a LLM.

Re: How BYD got EV chargers to work almost as fast as gas pumps

#79

Post by deeg »

_fizz_buzz_ wrote: post #56
nneonneo wrote: post #34

Based on the figures here, they’re claiming around 400 miles of range added in 300 seconds (60% of the full 677 mile range); contrast this with around 100 seconds for a typical gas pump (8 gal/min) and typical efficiency (30 mpg). It suggests that you’d need around 5MW chargers to truly get to the speed of a gas pump. On the other hand, 5 minutes is already a huge improvement over 15-30 minutes, and it’s fast enough…

5mins is really as good as it has to be. Almost everyone needs a bathroom break or gets a drink/snack after 400miles.

Its also fast enough that I don't have to plan for it. I could be running errands, note a low charge, and unless I'm in a big hurry stop for a charge.

Re: How BYD got EV chargers to work almost as fast as gas pumps

#80

Post by tim333 »

orbital-decay wrote: post #63

>Just taking an existing fast charger with 150- or 350-kW capacity and swapping in the latest and greatest 1,500-kW chargers wouldn’t get anyone faster speeds. The system would need all new “pipes”—grid capacity—to actually move that much current. The grid doesn't necessarily mean "pipes" or power lines. You don't build a pipeline to every gas station. Mobile charging robots work pretty well in China.

Also I guess they could put a large battery at the charging station so it can take say a steady 200kw from the grid and be able to kick out 1500kw for ten minutes occasionally. That could also charge from cheap off peak electricity.
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