Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Federal Right to Privacy Act – Draft legislation

righttoprivacyact.github.io

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

71–79 of 79 posts

Re: Federal Right to Privacy Act – Draft legislation

#71

Post by egberts1 »

normalaccess wrote: post #66
egberts1 wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Let's call it "Ad machinam". A literal form of "to the machine”: none of the rights that a person has. Example usage: “That’s not a rebuttal; it’s an argumentum ad machinam -- you’re rejecting it just because AI wrote it.”

And really when you think about it, all AI is is just the a statical recombination of (almost) everything that (almost) everyone has written. So it's a kind of mechanical recombination of ideas.

Almost like reject the argument because the logical reasoning was supplied emotionally.

Re: Federal Right to Privacy Act – Draft legislation

#72

Post by panny »

JoshTriplett wrote: post #11
panny wrote: post #10

>Update CAN-SPAM for one-click deletion of email addresses from databases. Then how can I know not to send you another email if I don't have your email flagged in my database to do-not-send?

You delete the rest of your spam database and replace it with `fn can_send_spam(_: Email) -> bool { false }`. You delete the "can we spam you" checkbox from your checkout page and replace it with "return false". For legitimate newsletters and similar: you delete any and all forms that allow signing up to receive emails without affirmative consent from that email address that they want to receive mail , and you offer…

>The only legitimate database of emails is "these people have explicitly confirmed to us that we can email them"; any other database is radioactive waste, delete it.

That's not actually how HIPAA compliance works. You're required to keep 7 years of communications, and part of those communications is who you sent it to. Amazon SES sends complaint notifications and you're not allowed more than 1 complaint per 1000 emails or they shut you down too. People who are repulsively anti-spam have ruined email as a medium.

I'm merely pointing out the technical aspect of this bill is ridiculous and everyone sending transactional emails will fight you, killing any bill you might have.

Re: Federal Right to Privacy Act – Draft legislation

#73

Post by JoshTriplett »

panny wrote: post #72
JoshTriplett wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You delete the rest of your spam database and replace it with `fn can_send_spam(_: Email) -> bool { false }`. You delete the "can we spam you" checkbox from your checkout page and replace it with "return false". For legitimate newsletters and similar: you delete any and all forms that allow signing up to receive emails without affirmative consent from that email address that they want to receive mail , and you offer…

>The only legitimate database of emails is "these people have explicitly confirmed to us that we can email them"; any other database is radioactive waste, delete it. That's not actually how HIPAA compliance works. You're required to keep 7 years of communications, and part of those communications is who you sent it to. Amazon SES sends complaint notifications and you're not allowed more than 1 complaint per 1000 emai…

> People who are repulsively anti-spam have ruined email as a medium.

That is a ridiculous attitude. Spam has ruined email; anti-spam is the attempt to keep it usable. Anti-spam wouldn't be needed in the first place if not for spammers.

> Amazon SES sends complaint notifications and you're not allowed more than 1 complaint per 1000 emails or they shut you down too.

Good, that sounds like a reasonable step.

Now if only there were existential-level fines for sending spam, too.

Yes, I am aware of people who use the "report spam" button because they can't be bothered to hit "unsubscribe". Which wouldn't be as much of a problem if 1) they felt like they'd subscribed in the first place, rather than being tricked by a default-to-spamming "do you not not not want us to not spam you" checkbox, 2) spammers didn't act like having an "unsubscribe" link was all they need to do to make it okay to send unsolicited commercial email, and 3) unsubscribing reliably worked.

> transactional emails

Transactional emails have never been the problem. People buying lists of emails and sending email marketing spam and trying to defend that as in any way a legitimate practice have always been the problem, along with phishing, scams, etc.

Re: Federal Right to Privacy Act – Draft legislation

#74

Post by thbb123 »

samrus wrote: post #60
thbb123 wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In Europe, more and more public transportation is free, or at least very heavily subsidized The costs are covered by local taxes, to curb on individual vehicle use and reduce congestion. After some hiccups, some cities manage good economies of scale where everybody, including the environment, wins. As for housing and food, while there the incentive structure is more fragile, at least, we have homeless shelters that a…

If transportation, housing, and food were paid for by giving private corporations and they demanded to incade our privacy as payment then i would be against that too actually

But in this occurrence, they are public services, under the public administration's control.

Successful socialism if you want.

Re: Federal Right to Privacy Act – Draft legislation

#75

Post by throwaway81523 »

cassonmars wrote: post #37
burnt-resistor wrote: post #25

The oligarchs would roll on the ground laughing at this cute desire from the plebs for a few crumbs. The system is so corrupt and bought, it doesn't matter if this passes or not because it will be diluted, unenforced, and/or overturned by a largely corrupt legislature, executive, and judiciary. All hopeful this time™ feel-good efforts will turn to shit until the corruption is sufficiently removed and prevented. No am…

How do you propose fixing the corruption?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DlGsQU4ZNhU

Re: Federal Right to Privacy Act – Draft legislation

#76

Post by dotancohen »

thbb123 wrote: post #74
samrus wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If transportation, housing, and food were paid for by giving private corporations and they demanded to incade our privacy as payment then i would be against that too actually

But in this occurrence, they are public services, under the public administration's control. Successful socialism if you want.

So where does the money come from?

Re: Federal Right to Privacy Act – Draft legislation

#77

Post by panny »

JoshTriplett wrote: post #73
panny wrote: post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>The only legitimate database of emails is "these people have explicitly confirmed to us that we can email them"; any other database is radioactive waste, delete it. That's not actually how HIPAA compliance works. You're required to keep 7 years of communications, and part of those communications is who you sent it to. Amazon SES sends complaint notifications and you're not allowed more than 1 complaint per 1000 emai…

> People who are repulsively anti-spam have ruined email as a medium. That is a ridiculous attitude. Spam has ruined email; anti-spam is the attempt to keep it usable. Anti-spam wouldn't be needed in the first place if not for spammers. > Amazon SES sends complaint notifications and you're not allowed more than 1 complaint per 1000 emails or they shut you down too. Good, that sounds like a reasonable step. Now if onl…

>That is a ridiculous attitude. Spam has ruined email; anti-spam is the attempt to keep it usable. Anti-spam wouldn't be needed in the first place if not for spammers.

Spam didn't close port 25 to residential ISP customers. Repulsive anti-spammers did that. I can't set up and run email on a rpi in my house without paying ridiculous fees to become "business" internet. And all you really get for that is port 25.

I've run my own email server at work. I doubt you have the experience I do. I sent 50,000 emails a day to patients for over a decade. Important emails, about their health. And repulsive anti-spammers come up with solutions like "you have to solve this captcha to send this important email to your patient on Earthlink!" So after a time, we simply had to give up running our own email server and run email through SES and let Amazon worry about the Earthlinks of the world for us. 99.9% no complaints sounds really really hard, but we actually cleared that bar pretty easily. Except that one day one of our doctors dumped hundreds of our emails, which HE PAYS TO RECIEVE, into the spam folder by accident.

I have ZERO empathy with repulsive anti-spammers. NONE. For they are the reason that email is the centralized shitshow it is today. We have AI now. AI should be able to tell us if email is spam very quickly now. Can we please have our port 25 back?

Re: Federal Right to Privacy Act – Draft legislation

#78

Post by burnt-resistor »

cassonmars wrote: post #37
burnt-resistor wrote: post #25

The oligarchs would roll on the ground laughing at this cute desire from the plebs for a few crumbs. The system is so corrupt and bought, it doesn't matter if this passes or not because it will be diluted, unenforced, and/or overturned by a largely corrupt legislature, executive, and judiciary. All hopeful this time™ feel-good efforts will turn to shit until the corruption is sufficiently removed and prevented. No am…

How do you propose fixing the corruption?

Nonviolent noncompliance, work stoppages, boycotts, sanctions, divestment, and further peaceful and effective measures until there are uniformly people in critical positions of power not beholden to the billionaire robber barons. Make it a criminal offense to be a paid lobbyist, abolish PACs and Citizens United, and every elected official profiteering. Keep going until wealth is firmly subordinate to civil authority. There is no perfect or magical plan that can be conveyed by a few sentences, so if you're out for a gotcha answer, you're not going to find a risk-free, batteries-included, cookie cutter blueprint anywhere from anyone.
Post reply on HN