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The Self-Help Trap: What 20 Years of "Optimizing" Has Taught Me

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Re: The Self-Help Trap: What 20 Years of "Optimizing" Has Taught Me

#71

Post by apsurd »

watwut wrote: post #68
apsurd wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's a lot of "I"s in your paragraph there. I think it's worth it to be ok with everyone being a little bit in the same boat of wanting to self-help, then becoming enamored with buddhist ideas, then grappling with everyday being just another human. In whatever order. I'm sure you mean well but just kinda irked me that you immediately put in the effort to "nope can't relate"

If someone makes generic statements that apply to all, it is 100% ok to answer with I cant relate. Frankly, even superior. Too many people frame own feelings and individual experiences and general universal or even rational truths.

I get that but it's also why i'm calling it out. it does come off as superior!

and then goes on to superior-ily talk about selflessness.

Re: The Self-Help Trap: What 20 Years of "Optimizing" Has Taught Me

#72

Post by gtrplyrjimi »

rramadass wrote: post #65

Nonsense; This guy (and others of his ilk) is just a hustler. People seem to lose all their common sense as soon as somebody trots out easy-sounding-without-effort-for-the-price-of-a-book soothing advice to solve all their problems. Meanwhile the real "self-help" exists in plain sight in the domains of Philosophy and Psychology coupled with an understanding of Neuroscience/Biology. People should checkout Hindu Philos…

I would argue Jung (with a side of Freud and Adler) covers psychology. Relationship with the Self, our "internal generator of meaning", is the purpose of any "self-help".

Re: The Self-Help Trap: What 20 Years of "Optimizing" Has Taught Me

#73

Post by reval »

The book that changed the game for me is “Leadership and Self-Deception”. The thesis being that the root of resentment is self-betrayal, where self-betrayal is denying your impulse to do right by others.

Ever since I read it, I’ve been more aware of when I am fixated on I and me.

It’s amazing. You can be completely “right” about a situation, yet still be fixated about the self. Escaping the box - terminology from the book - doesn’t change what’s real, but absolutely changes how you feel, and how your situation progresses.

Whether it is self help or blame or resentment, they are all in the box activities. There is another world- a better world.

Re: The Self-Help Trap: What 20 Years of "Optimizing" Has Taught Me

#74

Post by kdidjwkdj »

reval wrote: post #73

The book that changed the game for me is “Leadership and Self-Deception”. The thesis being that the root of resentment is self-betrayal, where self-betrayal is denying your impulse to do right by others. Ever since I read it, I’ve been more aware of when I am fixated on I and me. It’s amazing. You can be completely “right” about a situation, yet still be fixated about the self. Escaping the box - terminology from the…

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Re: The Self-Help Trap: What 20 Years of "Optimizing" Has Taught Me

#75

Post by kdidjwkdj »

apsurd wrote: post #71
watwut wrote: post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If someone makes generic statements that apply to all, it is 100% ok to answer with I cant relate. Frankly, even superior. Too many people frame own feelings and individual experiences and general universal or even rational truths.

I get that but it's also why i'm calling it out. it does come off as superior! and then goes on to superior-ily talk about selflessness.

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Re: The Self-Help Trap: What 20 Years of "Optimizing" Has Taught Me

#76

Post by kdidjwkdj »

Throaway1985123 wrote: post #67
matwood wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Adventure can take many forms, you just have to look outside yourself to see. For example, I’ve flown to Paris many times, that’s no longer an adventure for me (though I do love visiting the Louvre any time I’m in Paris). Finding adventure and interest in everyday life whether it’s traveling to a new place or visiting my local coffee shop is the real adventure for me. So many people are amazing, but you have to be cu…

K but the person in his example said he was fine doing the same thing he had been doing for the bast decade, not that he didn't want to go to Paris cause hed already gone there. People enjoy their little ruts because they dont want to leave their comfort zone.

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Re: The Self-Help Trap: What 20 Years of "Optimizing" Has Taught Me

#77

Post by kdidjwkdj »

DieErde wrote: post #32
rendx wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Have you actually shown genuine interest in their adventures, or is it you who defines what is adventurous and what is not, and not see that they defend against your interests, and by that protect their own? Why do you feel the need to make decisions for them? Is it you that is unhappy about their choices, or is it them? (How did your parents react to your wishes and desires? Was your autonomy celebrated, or dismisse…

I'm not making decisions for anybody. You can stay at home and watch your garden grow. Fine with me. I described what type of people I like. And that those are rather the pyramid climbers.

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Re: The Self-Help Trap: What 20 Years of "Optimizing" Has Taught Me

#78

Post by watwut »

apsurd wrote: post #71
watwut wrote: post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If someone makes generic statements that apply to all, it is 100% ok to answer with I cant relate. Frankly, even superior. Too many people frame own feelings and individual experiences and general universal or even rational truths.

I get that but it's also why i'm calling it out. it does come off as superior! and then goes on to superior-ily talk about selflessness.

It is superion in the sense that it is more honest.

When you frame "talking about own feeling and experiences as arrogamt, because it does not pretend generality, you are being wrong. Nothing in what I said implies superiority complex or arrogance.

And frankly, your twist is fairly manipulative sleazy bullshit.

Re: The Self-Help Trap: What 20 Years of "Optimizing" Has Taught Me

#79

Post by rendx »

RugnirViking wrote: post #40
rendx wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

From my own experience, and yours might differ, I typically don't find that pretty or rich (or any other such attributes) make for more interesting and nicer. Why is it either selfless saint or egocentrism? You can do both!

I imagine the person is talking about optimising along the lines you personally value for. Some people may value being with other interesting people (and being interesting themselves), wheras others prefer to be around smart people, or beautiful people, or rich people. Many see some of these desires as misguided or foolish or vain or whatever (often when it conflicts with their own values), but it is true that at lea…

My point being: If you value hanging out with people you don't like, it's still "selfish" (revolving around your own values).
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