71–80 of 332 posts
Earlier quoted context omitted.
Servo was passed onto Linux Foundation and is still being developed, some of its components are shared with Firefox.
Yet, after all these years its browser is quite frankly pre-historic.
Why did Ladybird even attempt this with Swift, but (I presume) not with Rust? If they're going to go to the trouble of adding another language, does Rust not have a better history of C++ interop? Not to mention, Swift's GC doesn't seem great for the browser's performance.
Earlier quoted context omitted.
What are you talking about? It doesn't have a "browser", it has a testing shell. For a time there was actual attempt with the Verso experiment but it got shelved just recently. Servo is working at being embeddable at the same time when Rust GUI toolkits are maturing. Once it gets embedding stabilized that will be the time for a full blown browser developement.
> It doesn't have a "browser", it has a testing shell. So, yes it is still pre-historic. > Once it gets embedding stabilized that will be the time for a full blown browser developement. Servo development began in 2012. [0] 14 years later we get a v0.0.1. At this point, Ladybird will likely reach 1.0 faster than Servo could, and the latter is not even remotely close to being usable even in 14 years of waiting. [0] htt…
When Servo is done, it's going to be a beast.
It's getting hundreds of commits per week:
I remember mocking the switch to Swift back then. Swift is a poorly designed language, slow to compile, visibly not on path to be major system language, and they had no expert on the team. I am glad they are cutting their losses.
Swift has it's problems, and I certainly wouldn't use it for anything outside of development for Apple platforms, but saying they had no experts on the team is a stretch. Most Swift leads were highly regarded members of the C++ world, even if you discount Chris Lattner.
I remember mocking the switch to Swift back then. Swift is a poorly designed language, slow to compile, visibly not on path to be major system language, and they had no expert on the team. I am glad they are cutting their losses.
Swift has it's problems, and I certainly wouldn't use it for anything outside of development for Apple platforms, but saying they had no experts on the team is a stretch. Most Swift leads were highly regarded members of the C++ world, even if you discount Chris Lattner.
Earlier quoted context omitted.
> It doesn't have a "browser", it has a testing shell. So, yes it is still pre-historic. > Once it gets embedding stabilized that will be the time for a full blown browser developement. Servo development began in 2012. [0] 14 years later we get a v0.0.1. At this point, Ladybird will likely reach 1.0 faster than Servo could, and the latter is not even remotely close to being usable even in 14 years of waiting. [0] htt…
This is disingenuous. Servo is using RUST, language which grew together with it, pretty much, and all components surrounding it. C++ is how old, please remind me?
And no, they're not being disingenuous.
There's no way to say this without sounding mean: Everything Chris Lattner has done has been a "successful mess". He's obviously smart, but a horrible engineer. No one should allow him to design anything. Edit: I explained my position better below.
LLVM: Pretty much everyone who has created a programming language with it has complained about its design. gingerbill, Jon Blow, and Andrew Kelley have all complained about it. LLVM is a good idea, but it that idea was executed better by Ken Thompson with his C compiler for Plan 9, and then again with his Go compiler design. Ken decided to create his own "architecture agnostic" assembly, which is very similar to the IR idea with LLVM.
Swift: I was very excited with the first release of Swift. But it ultimately did not have a very focused vision outlined for it. Because of this, it has morphed into a mess. It tries to be everything for everyone, like C++, and winds up being mediocre, and slow to compile to top it off.
Mojo isn't doesn't exist for the public yet. I hope it turns out to be awesome, but I'm just not going to get my hopes up this time.
I hate to be the one to point this out but really, in 10 years, how many rust ports will face the same fate?
I remember mocking the switch to Swift back then. Swift is a poorly designed language, slow to compile, visibly not on path to be major system language, and they had no expert on the team. I am glad they are cutting their losses.
What language do you recommend?
There's no way to say this without sounding mean: Everything Chris Lattner has done has been a "successful mess". He's obviously smart, but a horrible engineer. No one should allow him to design anything. Edit: I explained my position better below.
That's why there's nothing that comes close to LLVM and MLIR, right? If he's such a horrible engineer then we should have lots of LLVM replacements, right?