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Vibe coding is mad depressing

law.gmnz.xyz

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Re: Vibe coding is mad depressing

#71

Post by KiranRao0 »

irjustin wrote: post #41
satvikpendem wrote: post #6

This article is not about vibe coding per se, it's about not having strong boundaries between you as the developer, and your client. You should not be allowing the client to dictate how you work, much less them having the permissions to merge in code. This was true before AI too, where clients might say, do X this way, and you should simply say no, because they are paying for your expertise*. It's like hiring a plumb…

Us developers are experiencing what designers have had to deal with for decades. 2009 anyone? https://theoatmeal.com/comics/design_hell

My conclusion from the comic is that the client is happy. Clients like this don’t really want their designers expertise.

Re: Vibe coding is mad depressing

#72

Post by satisfice »

begueradj wrote: post #51
satvikpendem wrote: post #6

This article is not about vibe coding per se, it's about not having strong boundaries between you as the developer, and your client. You should not be allowing the client to dictate how you work, much less them having the permissions to merge in code. This was true before AI too, where clients might say, do X this way, and you should simply say no, because they are paying for your expertise*. It's like hiring a plumb…

> It's like hiring a plumber then trying to tell them how to fix the toilet. I never faced or witnessed that in software dev.

Us testers have been dealing with that crap forever. Every non-tester thinks they know how a professional tester should work, and imagines our work is just writing test cases.

Re: Vibe coding is mad depressing

#74

Post by hackingonempty »

irjustin wrote: post #41
satvikpendem wrote: post #6

This article is not about vibe coding per se, it's about not having strong boundaries between you as the developer, and your client. You should not be allowing the client to dictate how you work, much less them having the permissions to merge in code. This was true before AI too, where clients might say, do X this way, and you should simply say no, because they are paying for your expertise*. It's like hiring a plumb…

Us developers are experiencing what designers have had to deal with for decades. 2009 anyone? https://theoatmeal.com/comics/design_hell

Devs too, this one is at least 30 years old: https://www.pcuf.fi/~pjt/pink/software-architecture.html

Re: Vibe coding is mad depressing

#75

Post by ekropotin »

cweagans wrote: post #49
ekropotin wrote: post #28

Just want to highlight that gmnz.xyz domain is on UCEPROTECTL3 blacklist.

IMO, UCEPROTECTL3 is a scam and it's not worth even acknowledging their existence. https://www.reddit.com/r/sysadmin/comments/eur4ju/removal_fr... among many other similar posts. https://www.uceprotect.net/en/index.php?m=7&s=8 -- "pay us to fix a problem that we've caused, and if you have the gall to call it what it is (extortion), then we'll publish your email and be massive dicks about it" (To be clear, not all spa…

You may be right, and I'd be happy to ignore it, but unfortunately, my work laptop has baked it in. I assume many other companies are using it as well.

Re: Vibe coding is mad depressing

#76

Post by acosmism »

satvikpendem wrote: post #6

This article is not about vibe coding per se, it's about not having strong boundaries between you as the developer, and your client. You should not be allowing the client to dictate how you work, much less them having the permissions to merge in code. This was true before AI too, where clients might say, do X this way, and you should simply say no, because they are paying for your expertise*. It's like hiring a plumb…

pretty standard plumber prices

Re: Vibe coding is mad depressing

#77

Post by Groxx »

satvikpendem wrote: post #21
tptacek wrote: post #8

All the consulting practice arguments aside, this is fundamentally a gatekeeping argument about clients staying in their lane. I'm sure doctors feel the same way about patients with weirdly specific questions about HFpEF diagnoses. Doctors have always hated "Doctor Google", and now they have to contend with "Doctor GPT". It's up to you how much sympathy to have for them.

Not related to other types of clients, but for doctors and patients specifically, I have heard stories where doctors dismissed patients' concerns until the patients themselves googled and found out exactly what issue they had and then the doctors were much more amenable to solving it [0]. Indeed, [1] > researchers found that searching symptoms online modestly boosted patients’ ability to accurately diagnose health is…

which includes me / my parents, though we found a thankfully excellent primary care doctor while I was growing up who took the new information in stride and chased promising paths we managed to find. we learned a lot from each other in the process.

doctors don't generally have the time or inclination to spend unpaid time doing specialized research for one of their many patients. competent layman efforts are generally huge wastes of time compared to asking a specialist, but in the absence of a specialist they can still be extremely useful, and specialists don't know everything either. plus there aren't always specialists, whether affordable/accessible or sometimes existent at all.

Re: Vibe coding is mad depressing

#78

Post by technion »

begueradj wrote: post #51
satvikpendem wrote: post #6

This article is not about vibe coding per se, it's about not having strong boundaries between you as the developer, and your client. You should not be allowing the client to dictate how you work, much less them having the permissions to merge in code. This was true before AI too, where clients might say, do X this way, and you should simply say no, because they are paying for your expertise*. It's like hiring a plumb…

> It's like hiring a plumber then trying to tell them how to fix the toilet. I never faced or witnessed that in software dev.

There are multiple stories of public facing applications with Microsoft active directory as the source of user accounts that speak to the worst examples of this.

I was involved in such an attempt but it never got off the ground.

Re: Vibe coding is mad depressing

#79

Post by biql »

WhyOhWhyQ wrote: post #18

For me vibecoding has a similar feeling to a big bag of Doritos. It's really fun at first to slap down 10k lines of code in an afternoon knowing this is just an indulgence. I think AI is actually really useful for getting a quick view of some library or feature. Also, you can learn a lot if you approach it the right way. However, every time I do any amount of vibecoding eventually it just transitions into pure lethar…

This. First I try it just a little to do a boring part. It feels great. The boring part that was holding me is gone and all it took was a little instruction. The dopamine hit is real. So of course I will try it again. But not so fast. It needs to be corrected to make everything aligned with the architecture. And as my requests get bigger, it needs more and more corrections. Eventually correcting everything becomes too tedious, and accepting is just too easy, and so I lower my standards, and soon enough lose track of all the decisions. The branch is now useless as I don't want to debug or own this code I no longer understand hence I start over. I want work to felt like a training session where you get fairly rewarded for your efforts with better understanding, not like a slot machine where you passively hope it gets it right next time.

Re: Vibe coding is mad depressing

#80

Post by bunderbunder »

goosejuice wrote: post #50
satvikpendem wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not related to other types of clients, but for doctors and patients specifically, I have heard stories where doctors dismissed patients' concerns until the patients themselves googled and found out exactly what issue they had and then the doctors were much more amenable to solving it [0]. Indeed, [1] > researchers found that searching symptoms online modestly boosted patients’ ability to accurately diagnose health is…

It's not at all difficult for a scientifically literate person to be more up to date on the literature of something they have, or could have, than even a specialist in that broad area. There's too many disorders and not enough time. I have something that about a quarter percent of individuals have in the US. A young specialist would know how to treat based on guidelines but beyond that there's little benefit in keepi…

My PCP and I have a really good rapport, and so when I stated having weird confusing health problems they were quite happy to hear what I was finding in PubMed and then share their thoughts on it, and together we figured things out and got my situation handled. I thought it was a nicely complementary situation: they didn’t have the time to do a literature dive, and I didn’t have the expertise to fully understand what I was reading.

But I bet what happens more often is patients showing up with random unsubstantiated crap they found on Reddit or a content farm, and I can understand health care providers getting worn down by that sort of thing. I have a family member who believed he had Morgellon’s Disease, and talking to him about it was exhausting.

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