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France is taking state actions against GrapheneOS?

grapheneos.social

71–80 of 121 posts

Re: France is taking state actions against GrapheneOS?

#71
post #48

Liberté, Egalité, Fraternité, but just for a few. Remember the French goverment banning encryption in the 90's. The French elite hates science and math because it was modernly developed by the Brits, and they love to put Arts/Humanities bullshitters like Derrida on top as if they mattered something over Francis Bacon and Newton. Just watch any TF1 talk show and you'll understand what I mean. Or, well, any state suppo…

France does not reimburse homeopathic treatments anymore. The NHS in the UK went even further, they funded homeopathic hospitals like the Royal London Homeopathic Hospital and reimbursed homeopathy until 2017.

Re: France is taking state actions against GrapheneOS?

#72
post #19

This hostility towards privacy all over the world signals that there is a co-ordinated change happening in the world. Unfortunately we still don't know what it is or what its goals are.

Specifically, we don't know the goals. Generally, we know it's about control and fear of losing power. It's a stolen quote but rings true: Those with power fear one thing above all else; losing said power.

That doesn't quite explain it. The internet has happily been a niche wild west for a long time that has threatened very little power. Besides generally "most people know how evil all rich people have to be to get where they are now"

Re: France is taking state actions against GrapheneOS?

#73
post #19

This hostility towards privacy all over the world signals that there is a co-ordinated change happening in the world. Unfortunately we still don't know what it is or what its goals are.

There's no single mastermind. This current wave of authoritarianism around the world is a consequence of not designing the Internet with democratic principles in mind. Online content discovery and moderation mechanisms are centralized and authoritarian in nature. And since most communication nowadays happens on the Internet on large platforms with millions of users (this is especially true after smartphones and social media were invented), the structure of human society in the real world is mirroring the Internet.

This can be solved, though. We have to move moderation and ranking mechanisms to the client-side, especially for search engines and social media. Each person should be able to decide what they post and see, but not what anyone else posts or sees.

Re: France is taking state actions against GrapheneOS?

#74
post #51

> > I am preparing an article on the use of your secure personal data phone solution by drug traffickers and other criminals. I think GrapheneOS needs a really good PR expert volunteer, or funding to pay for a non-volunteer. My non-PR-expert guesses are... If the journalist is in bad faith or flaky, that might need to be handled. But if the journalist is in good faith, this might be an opportunity, to promote Graphen…

No, one should never ever talk to journalists. Nothing good can come from it. Never assume good faith from journalists.

It's true with Indian journalists. You say one thing and they twist it the other way around.

Re: France is taking state actions against GrapheneOS?

#75
post #19

This hostility towards privacy all over the world signals that there is a co-ordinated change happening in the world. Unfortunately we still don't know what it is or what its goals are.

Yeah well there is definitely something going on, a coordinated effort to condemn GrapheneOS with faint praise (and outright scare-mongering). Here I have posted a video url I'd downloaded and watched a few days ago. It's TTS slop narration, but it makes an attempt to characterize GrapheneOS as a 'double-edged sword', because, you know, criminals. Just like the hatchet job from France.

'GrapheneOS Update 2025 Privacy Savior or Hacker’s Paradise'

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aCgi6bJy-qo

I get all my utube from the bash-prompt (and never have to deal with algorithm or see who is who and what else is there), so I don't know who posted this video to YouTube, but maybe there's more?

This could be a case study in an amateur low-grade half-ass influence operation.

On the other hand, it could simply be a grudge, a coordinated personal attack on the lead dev.

There are a slew of other videos by YouTube personalities who, at various times, seem to be disparaging the guy, including a very upset Grossman (right-to-repair guy).

Or hey, maybe it's just coincidence. C'est la vie!

Re: France is taking state actions against GrapheneOS?

#76

The referenced article: http://archive.today/I65wv

We weren't given a chance to see what was being claimed and properly respond to it. Our response at the end of the article was to this prompt, which was in the first and only email we received, in English:

> I am preparing an article on the use of your secure personal data phone solution by drug traffickers and other criminals. Have you ever been contacted by the police?

The claims in the main story strongly indicate they're not talking about GrapheneOS itself but rather companies selling closed source forks of it with significant modifications. They refer to features which don't exist in GrapheneOS. Supposedly GrapheneOS which is freely available from https://grapheneos.org/install/web and https://grapheneos.org/releases with sources on GitHub is distributed on the "dark web" and promoted via unlisted YouTube videos. They're clearly conflating products which market themselves by saying they're using GrapheneOS with the upstream project those are forked from. These are largely sketchy products and we regularly have to deal with them infringing on our copyright and trademarks.

One of these companies marketing products claiming to use GrapheneOS, ANOM, turned out to be a company run by the FBI as a sting operation which was hiring criminals to sell phones to other criminals. ANOM told people what they were getting was GrapheneOS when it was actually a mix of GrapheneOS and LineageOS code. The FBI was broadly facilitating crime in Europe by providing them devices they considered secure and safe to use while disregarding most of it to avoid exposing their operation. They were also misusing our brand and harming our reputation us through this. A lot of the claimed criminal usage was directly engineered by the FBI. A detailed podcast episode on this:

https://darknetdiaries.com/transcript/146/

There's also this second article from the same paper containing the explicit threat referred to in our posts:

https://archive.is/UrlvK

It says that if we don't cooperate, they'll take similar actions against us they did against 2 named secure phone companies. Those actions were taking over their servers and criminal charges. It's clear what they want is a backdoor to have access to devices they're unable to exploit due to the advanced exploit protections. They're threatening that if this is not provided, they'll go after us as they did companies they said were collaborating with criminals. They likely consider providing freely available open source software which anyone can use for any purpose to be collaborating with criminals.

The main result will be OVH losing our business to a Toronto colocation provider for important non-static content (discussion forum, email, Matrix, Mastodon, attestation service), Vultr (American) for our anycast DNS + exotic webserver locations, Netcup (German) and perhaps another 1-2 companies for NA/EU web servers where Vultr is extremely overpriced due to double the costs for the same specs and metered bandwidth (it's great for exotic locations and BGP support for our anycast though).

There's another article here, but the paywall isn't bypassed by archive sites (we've read it though):

https://archive.is/FBc1U

Re: France is taking state actions against GrapheneOS?

#79
It's funny. It just struck me that the EU is uniquely well positioned to develop an alternative to Android and iOS.

Start with one of the open source projects - I guess an Android derivative, sans all the Google stuff. Give them funding, maybe regulate (that always helps).

Then mandate that within X years, various key apps must provide for this system - things like bank apps, state admin apps etc. In high likelihood, development would be close enough to Android that it would not be a crazy high burden - and anyway, it seems most people use cross platform frameworks.

EU could regulate, or influence via ownership, privacy controls better tailored to European tastes.

That would give the EU a dose of digital sovereignty without doing much, and ensuring some degree of usability.

It's a shame that instead GrapheneOS seems to get sued.

Re: France is taking state actions against GrapheneOS?

#80
post #6

What is wrong with that guy in the comments shouting? Christ on a stick, this is the worst crash out I've seen over something like this

Yeah, people be random sometimes, internet can be hostile. But why is @GrapheneOS still engaging? After 2-3 messages you won't really improve on anything, and their goal is probably to just suck energy, so the only way to win is to not engage at all. Also ruins the conversations about the the content, instead people end up focusing on that crazy-on-one-side exchange. Internet 101: don't provide sustenance to the crea…

It's often possible to get through to people who are initially hostile. They were friendlier than a lot of the Free Software community on Mastodon and didn't even link to harassment content. They burned themselves out and stopped on their own so they're still not blocked.
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