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New magnetic component discovered in the Faraday effect

phys.org

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Re: New magnetic component discovered in the Faraday effect

#71

Post by wasabi991011 »

Noaidi wrote: post #70

I’m sorry if I offended anyone’s consciousness by bringing this up, but this can affect how we view the health effects of radio frequency electromagnetic fields. Since the magnetic fields of these EMF’s can pass deeper into the body than the electric field, that would mean that the magnetic field can affect many of the voltage gated ion channels in the body. That’s including the brain.

> Since the magnetic fields of these EMF’s can pass deeper into the body than the electric field,

Can they actually though?

I'm not an expert, but to my knowledge the penetration depth of an electromagnetic wave depends only on its frequency. I can't find anywhere online that makes a distinction between electric waves and magnetic waves.

Re: New magnetic component discovered in the Faraday effect

#72

Post by sevensor »

namanyayg wrote: post #2

We intuitively think in particles and see a world of billiard balls colliding with one another. But actually everything is merely waves and fields. There's going to be a time where humans finally reconcile the quantum with the newtonian -- and I can't wait for that day

I disagree. Our notion of waves is no less an analogy to macroscopic phenomena than billiard balls. There’s no avoiding the dual nature, and there’s no problem with saying that the wave analogy works in some places, but the particle analogy works in others. The only real truth here is “neither.” A photon is a photon, and there is no macroscopic analogy it reduces to perfectly.

Re: New magnetic component discovered in the Faraday effect

#73

Post by B1FF_PSUVM »

isolli wrote: post #40
fnordpiglet wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There’s no explanation of gravity, quantum or no. There are merely descriptions.

Isn't everything descriptions, in the end, aka models? Turtles all the way down...

"Two masses attract each other with a force F = m1 m2 G/r^2"

"OK, but why don't they repel each other?"

"That would make life really hard, and we wouldn't be here discussing it ..."

Re: New magnetic component discovered in the Faraday effect

#74

Post by szundi »

sevensor wrote: post #72
namanyayg wrote: post #2

We intuitively think in particles and see a world of billiard balls colliding with one another. But actually everything is merely waves and fields. There's going to be a time where humans finally reconcile the quantum with the newtonian -- and I can't wait for that day

I disagree. Our notion of waves is no less an analogy to macroscopic phenomena than billiard balls. There’s no avoiding the dual nature, and there’s no problem with saying that the wave analogy works in some places, but the particle analogy works in others. The only real truth here is “neither.” A photon is a photon, and there is no macroscopic analogy it reduces to perfectly.

[dead]

Re: New magnetic component discovered in the Faraday effect

#75

Post by vixen99 »

piva00 wrote: post #49
isolli wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We're built on so many layers of emergence, it's wild! quantum particles => atoms => chemistry => biochemistry => cellular life => multi-cellular life => intelligence

It can keep going! Intelligence -> societies -> technology -> ? One has to wonder how far can emergence stretch given enough time, some kind of entropic limit probably exists but I'm just a layman, hopefully someone more knowledgeable can share if we already know a physical hard limit for emergence.

After a brilliant start (atoms etc.,) it starts to be problematic once one hits societies. After all, the earlier progressions are undeniably astounding stable successes in their various incarnations. A pessimist might say 'Stable' societies so far have tended eventually towards being self-destructive tyrannies.

Re: New magnetic component discovered in the Faraday effect

#76

Post by ta988 »

zyxzevn wrote: post #62
namanyayg wrote: post #2

We intuitively think in particles and see a world of billiard balls colliding with one another. But actually everything is merely waves and fields. There's going to be a time where humans finally reconcile the quantum with the newtonian -- and I can't wait for that day

3Blue1Brown has a very good explanation of how light works as a wave And the barber pole effect shows how matter (sugar) rotates light https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QCX62YJCmGk There is also evidence that "photons" are just thresholds in the material that is used to detect light. The atoms vibrate with the EM-wave and at a certain threshold they switch to a higher vibration state that can release an electron. If th…

There are so many artifacts that could cause those observations that I emit serious doubts that's what is happening in those experiments.

Re: New magnetic component discovered in the Faraday effect

#77

Post by Noaidi »

wasabi991011 wrote: post #71
Noaidi wrote: post #70

I’m sorry if I offended anyone’s consciousness by bringing this up, but this can affect how we view the health effects of radio frequency electromagnetic fields. Since the magnetic fields of these EMF’s can pass deeper into the body than the electric field, that would mean that the magnetic field can affect many of the voltage gated ion channels in the body. That’s including the brain.

> Since the magnetic fields of these EMF’s can pass deeper into the body than the electric field, Can they actually though? I'm not an expert, but to my knowledge the penetration depth of an electromagnetic wave depends only on its frequency. I can't find anywhere online that makes a distinction between electric waves and magnetic waves.

When the electromagnetic wave hits a substance, it splits into separate electric and magnetic waves. The electric wave does not penetrate deeply, but magnetic waves can go through anything. Magnetic waves can only be diverted, not blocked.

Re: New magnetic component discovered in the Faraday effect

#78

Post by ithkuil »

canjobear wrote: post #19
namanyayg wrote: post #2

We intuitively think in particles and see a world of billiard balls colliding with one another. But actually everything is merely waves and fields. There's going to be a time where humans finally reconcile the quantum with the newtonian -- and I can't wait for that day

There's no problem reconciling the quantum with the Newtonian. Quantum mechanics recovers Newtonian mechanics in the appropriate limit. The problem is reconciling the quantum and the Einsteinian.

In particular with general relativity.

Quantum field theory (QFT) is quantum mechanics + special relativity

Re: New magnetic component discovered in the Faraday effect

#79

Post by kawfey »

Noaidi wrote: post #77
wasabi991011 wrote: post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Since the magnetic fields of these EMF’s can pass deeper into the body than the electric field, Can they actually though? I'm not an expert, but to my knowledge the penetration depth of an electromagnetic wave depends only on its frequency. I can't find anywhere online that makes a distinction between electric waves and magnetic waves.

When the electromagnetic wave hits a substance, it splits into separate electric and magnetic waves. The electric wave does not penetrate deeply, but magnetic waves can go through anything. Magnetic waves can only be diverted, not blocked.

Maxwell's equations have yet to be disproven but this comment implies otherwise.
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