71–80 of 90 posts
I’m not a fan of Wayland or a detractor of X. I’m not personally invested in either of them. I couldn’t care less what’s pushing pixels at my screen as long as it works. That said, what you need to know about Wayland is that the X.org devs mostly migrated to it en masse because they said X had hit an evolutionary dead end and couldn’t be dragged into the present, by the design of it. These were the people who were al…
This reads as significantly AI-assisted and repetitive. And some of the points are really questionable, like claiming “Color management becomes inconsistent” when X11 doesn’t even support HDR, claiming that Linux containers and namespaces somehow mitigate X11’s security issues (that’s not how it works!), and talking about some outdated issues like NVIDIA support and SSH forwarding (both of which shouldn’t be an issue…
A lot of the complaints are about supposedly missing features when X11 and Wayland aren't the same things, IIRC. X11 is a big ball of mud with all kinds of features. Wayland is an attempt to do one thing, and only one thing. You must bring in the other features (like window management and remote networking) as adjacent components. "This Phillip's-head screwdriver can't cut cheese or open a wine bottle."
It's fine to separate a small core protocol from extensions that flesh out the rest of the features. Wayland, however, did the small core and didn't bother to actually implement the rest, so 16 years on it still doesn't have feature parity.
> "This Phillip's-head screwdriver can't cut cheese or open a wine bottle."
Then stop handing me a screwdriver and telling me I should use it instead of my multitool.
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It’s mostly application support that’s lagging, right? And of course window managers like i3 needing complete replacement, but those seem to be mostly down already.
Some stuff like global hotkeys and remote desktop are Wayland problems inherently
I literally don't have the words to look down my nose at this. Former X11 contributor, compositor contributor, active distro maintainer. I just can't. I laughed. I scoffed. I incredulously looked at how much time someone with some braincells put into this. I don't care, I'm saying it. Fuck your fragmentation whining. USERS WANT THEIR SHIT TO WORK. They expect high refresh monitors to work. They expect to be able to u…
...You understand that this is the strongest pro-X11 argument, right? As a user, I don't care that the backend is messy, I care that my stuff works on Xorg and doesn't work on Wayland.
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All this time has been wasted by Wayland developers insisting that if Wayland makes something impossible by design, then users who want that thing are simply incorrect to want it and therefore it doesn't count. Wayland does not deliver on basic shit working, and as long as "that's incompatible with Wayland's security model" is considered an acceptable answer, it never will.
Name one thing Wayland's architecture disallows that is allowed on Windows or MacOS.
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I believe Chrome Remote Desktop worked for me in the past?
Thanks for the tip but only firefox is available on those systems. (And mine)
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Sending emulated key presses to a specific window.
Which OS allows that: MacOS or Windows or both? Doesn't sound safe.
Here's a way to do in Windows: https://www.autohotkey.com/docs/v1/lib/ControlSend.htm
And here's how to do it in macOS: https://apple.stackexchange.com/questions/36943/how-do-i-aut...
> Doesn't sound safe.
Yes, this is the usual excuse for why Wayland is intentionally useless. Fun fact: The only difference between a11y software and really awful malware is that the a11y programs work for me, the user. If you make features impossible in the name of "protecting" me, you break things for me.
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Thanks for the tip but only firefox is available on those systems. (And mine)
Is the issue with Wayland for sure or is it possible the Flatpak permissions are blocking access? I've used the app Flatseal to open up the sandbox to fix things before.
Without necessarily supporting or opposing the statements (because I have no opinion about Wayland after all), the first public mention of this website seems to be [1]. [1] https://x.com/probonopd/status/1955387873659850828
"Think twice before abandoning X11. Wayland breaks everything!"
https://gist.github.com/probonopd/9feb7c20257af5dd915e3a9f2d...
This could be a web-ified version.
I have emailed with ProbonoPD, AKA Simon Peter. He is smart, motivated, and knows his stuff. He is the man behind Appimage (which I personally prefer to either Snap or Flatpak) as well as the "Hello System" FreeBSD distro.