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Lithium compound can reverse Alzheimer’s in mice: study
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Re: Lithium compound can reverse Alzheimer’s in mice: study
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Re: Lithium compound can reverse Alzheimer’s in mice: study
#73Watch out, there is no reliable Mouse Model for Alzheimer's. I was deeply involved with mouse models at some point before quitting my phd in neuroscience and I quite remember that.
> Lithium was the only metal that differed significantly between people with and without mild cognitive impairment, often a precursor to Alzheimer’s disease.
Not a causative finding in humans but darn interesting
Re: Lithium compound can reverse Alzheimer’s in mice: study
#74Lithium orotate is available over the counter. People could try it today. > Since lithium has not yet been shown to be safe or effective in protecting against neurodegeneration in humans, Yankner emphasizes that people should not take lithium compounds on their own I reject this kind of blind safetyism. A cursory search suggests that lithium orotate has been used for decades, and the article suggests that "profound e…
I tried Lithium Orotate at the typical supplement dose. After the first week it left me feeling rather blah. Discontinuing it reversed the feeling after a few days. I repeated this a couple more times with a repeatable outcome. It’s very hyped in supplement communities with claims that it’s perfectly safe and side effect free. I didn’t get any kidney damage or anything, but I also didn’t get a positive benefit from i…
Not for you, then, right? Pretty normal for many medicines, supplements, etc. I think it’s cool we can try things (even if they don’t always work).
Re: Lithium compound can reverse Alzheimer’s in mice: study
#75Given that tens of millions people have been treated for bipolar disorder with Lithium Carbonate, shouldn't researchers have already seen a correlation with Alzheimer's in patients?
Definitely, good point
Re: Lithium compound can reverse Alzheimer’s in mice: study
#76Earlier quoted context omitted.
People use it in much smaller dosages then it's usually prescribed to apparently beneficial effect. I believe its also in the water supply in certain places, so if it works for dementia there are natural experiments already running on this. https://www.psychiatrictimes.com/view/low-dose-lithium-a-new...
Yes, it's already thought that there's an association between naturally occurring lithium in drinking water and decreased suicide rates: https://www.cambridge.org/core/journals/the-british-journal-... I would think naturally occurring lithium in some people's water would give pretty good control conditions to do a wide study of this effect on Alzheimers as well?
(for others like myself)
Results
The literature search identified 415 articles; of these, 15 ecological studies were included in the synthesis. The random-effects meta-analysis showed a consistent protective (or inverse) association between lithium levels/concentration in publicly available drinking water and total (pooled β = −0.27, 95% CI −0.47 to −0.08; P = 0.006, I2 = 83.3%), male (pooled β = −0.26, 95% CI −0.56 to 0.03; P = 0.08, I2 = 91.9%) and female (pooled β = −0.13, 95% CI −0.24 to −0.02; P = 0.03, I2 = 28.5%) suicide mortality rates. A similar protective association was observed in the six studies included in the narrative synthesis, and subgroup meta-analyses based on the higher/lower suicide mortality rates and lithium levels/concentration.
Re: Lithium compound can reverse Alzheimer’s in mice: study
#77Lithium orotate is available over the counter. People could try it today. > Since lithium has not yet been shown to be safe or effective in protecting against neurodegeneration in humans, Yankner emphasizes that people should not take lithium compounds on their own I reject this kind of blind safetyism. A cursory search suggests that lithium orotate has been used for decades, and the article suggests that "profound e…
Completely agree. The other thing that was very encouraging about the study is that it actually reversed memory decline - it's not like you needed to take it for years/decades in advance to prevent that decline in the first place, so you can make the choice when the risk/reward tradeoff is much clearer.
Having seen a few family members succumb to dementia, it's not a path I want to take. Fuck up my kidneys and give me an early death, fine, but if I start showing the signs of that type of mental decline, I'm taking the lithium orotate.
My related biggest concern about this is that since it's a cheap supplement that can't be patented, it won't be a priority for the drug industry to study. Another reason to not necessarily trust the "Just slowly die by Alzheimers until we find the perfectly safe (patentable) antidote" crowd.
Re: Lithium compound can reverse Alzheimer’s in mice: study
#78Interestingly, the proposed mechanism seems consistent with the apparent small benefit of anti-amyloid antibody therapy: if amyloid deposits interfere with lithium uptake, then removing them could restore some lithium availability without doing anything about the underlying initial cause of insufficient lithium.
Re: Lithium compound can reverse Alzheimer’s in mice: study
#79There are so many misconceptions about lithium wrt to the human body.
I don't know why so many people differentiate between lithium orotate and the lithium carbonate in psychiatry. Although they differ in absorption the active component is the lithium ion in both cases. Dosage is done according to lithium content, there are tables for converting from orotate to carbonate and back.
Then the effects of lithium orotate and carbonate can't be that different. And thus, above a particular dose blood monitoring is mandatory.
There are benefits of low dose lithium for sure. And the dosages in psychiatry have been on a steady decline. With lower doses come less side effects. It is definitly not the hammer of psychiatry that turns people into zombies or messes. It feels quite natural.
In addition the reduction of Alzheimers cases is not unique to lithium. Many meds cause Alzheimers rates in mentally ill people to decline to general population levels.
Re: Lithium compound can reverse Alzheimer’s in mice: study
#80Lithium is a strange drug. It also cures bipolar disorder and nobody knows why. It also fucks up the liver over time and basically people on lithium eventually have to make a choice between dying or being insane.
That's quite a stretch. Lithium does not cure bipolar disorder nor is it effective in many afflicted. Also, Lithium is not the only medication for Bipolar Disorder, there are a double-digit number of alternative options. Also, to my knowledge, we are not entirely sure why most, if not all, of the psychiatric drugs work. Plenty of hypotheses though.
Lithium cures Bipolar the same way all the other psych meds do. They don't. They just manage symptoms. Like insulin does, or antihistamines, etc. A propper cure is rare in medicine.