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Apple's Browser Engine Ban Persists, Even Under the DMA

open-web-advocacy.org

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Re: Apple's Browser Engine Ban Persists, Even Under the DMA

#71

Post by idonotknowwhy »

stavros wrote: post #53
jeroenhd wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can run Gnome Web for free. It's the open source version of WebKit so you won't be able to see all the tweaks Apple adds to their proprietary build, but it's close enough that obvious differences are visible, at least on desktop. Safari on iOS cannot be tested without paying Apple so I generally don't for my personal stuff either. All of that said, American developers often can't even be bothered to support chara…

Right, but approximately zero people have ever said "this website doesn't work on Firefox, so I won't use this website". They say "this website doesn't work on Firefox, so I won't use Firefox".

Zero percent maybe. I personally changed banks when they broke Firefox support and said to use chrome.

I welcome the Safari walled garden because if Apple have to allow chrome on ios, that's the end of any cross browser testing (and the end of Firefox)

Re: Apple's Browser Engine Ban Persists, Even Under the DMA

#73

Post by mcny »

pickledoyster wrote: post #57
TheDong wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I mean, ideally you can choose to _not_ do so, tell your users "We only support Firefox and Chrome on iOS, and not Safari, because we do not own apple hardware", and then report bugs to mozilla/chrome if iOS users report differences. Being able to run cross-platform browsers on iOS does in fact make the very thing you're complaining about better. I would love it if the EU did in fact force apple to release a cross-pl…

> tell your users "We only support Firefox and Chrome on iOS, and not Safari, because we do not own apple hardware" I'd be pissed if someone did that for my browser engine of choice. Also, from what I understand, Apple still leads in accessibility, so this would be an asshole move towards consumers stuck in that ecosystem just because Google and Microsoft can't get their act together.

> I'd be pissed if someone did that for my browser engine of choice.

I read it differently. I don't think they said somehow block people from using their browser of choice, but that if you report an issue, the first thing tech support will do is ask you to use a different browser. I think it is reasonable.

Re: Apple's Browser Engine Ban Persists, Even Under the DMA

#74

Post by IshKebab »

pickledoyster wrote: post #55

On top of that, iOS continues to push Safari on users by disregarding their default browser settings. Steps to reproduce: 0. Select a different default browser, delete the Safari app (just for good measure, even though it's not really possible just like deleting IE in older Win versions) 1. Open the Books app 2. Select text 3. Select Search 4. Press Search the Web 5. Safari search results open as you stare in disbeli…

Google does this too on Android in a few places. Stuff still opens in Chrome even if Firefox is the default.

Re: Apple's Browser Engine Ban Persists, Even Under the DMA

#75

Post by kosinus »

stavros wrote: post #53
jeroenhd wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can run Gnome Web for free. It's the open source version of WebKit so you won't be able to see all the tweaks Apple adds to their proprietary build, but it's close enough that obvious differences are visible, at least on desktop. Safari on iOS cannot be tested without paying Apple so I generally don't for my personal stuff either. All of that said, American developers often can't even be bothered to support chara…

Right, but approximately zero people have ever said "this website doesn't work on Firefox, so I won't use this website". They say "this website doesn't work on Firefox, so I won't use Firefox".

I think that is true when you initially switch and are still comparing browsers, but I certainly no longer check if something broken happens to work in Chrome. Stuff may equally be broken by my adblocker. Too lazy to debug someone else's work.

Re: Apple's Browser Engine Ban Persists, Even Under the DMA

#78

Post by the_third_wave »

LadyCailin wrote: post #28
kouteiheika wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Your shiny new iPhone exists because European ASML supplied the machines to make the chips inside of it. The pro-Apple bias on HN is truly insufferable sometimes.

I think it’s more an anti-EU bias. Capitalists can’t stand consumers having choices.

It is both fruit factory fanboyism as well as anti-EU sentiment and it has nothing to do with 'capitalists' not liking 'consumers' having choices. Without capitalism the problem would not exist, so much is true. It would not exist because there wouldn't be anything to choose from: no browser market, no mobile devices, no choice. This tired anti-capitalism rhetoric needs to be shelved with the other books from the 60's and 70's.

Re: Apple's Browser Engine Ban Persists, Even Under the DMA

#79

Post by utf_8x »

selckin wrote: post #6

This Apple policy is the only thing stopping chrome from having a full monopoly, and we should be careful trying to remove it

Maybe that wouldn't be the worst thing. Maybe chrome capturing the majority of the iOS market would finally be the proverbial straw that breaks the camel's back and pushes regulators towards forcing Google to sell Chrome.

Re: Apple's Browser Engine Ban Persists, Even Under the DMA

#80

Post by idonotknowwhy »

rafaelmn wrote: post #66
selckin wrote: post #6

This Apple policy is the only thing stopping chrome from having a full monopoly, and we should be careful trying to remove it

Google has an incentive to make everything work through the web. Safari has the incentive to gatekeep the app store revenue, which is why PWAs are a joke on iOS. Google also has bad incentives (Android, ads) but Safari is the IE6 of modern web.

Chrome is the IE6 of the modern Web. Devs are building hacky sites that only work in Chrome.

It's the browser we're FORCED to have installed for the occasional shitty flight or hotel booking that doesn't work in Firefox.

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