Occurences of swearing in the Linux kernel source code over time • Hacker News Board

Re: Occurences of swearing in the Linux kernel source code over time

#71

Post by mystified5016 » Mon, Jun 16, 2025, 2:27 PM UTC

Arainach wrote: post #40

holowoodman wrote: post #2

Theory: the shift towards lesser swearwords is a sign of corporatization, making the linux source a soulless bland hellscape of confirmity.

Hopefully in a few decades the last of the people who think that using respectful discourse means no fun can be had will be gone and we can stop rehashing these threads. You're contributing to something that runs on billions of devices across the world and is maintained by people around the world of all types. If you can't describe your code, your reasons, and your notes politely, do better.

Yeah, you tell 'em! Anyone who doesn't conform to Corporate Culture and treat the dress code and code of conduct as their own personal Bible, upheld even on their time off, they're all terrible engineers and should go work on some script kiddie project.

Re: Occurences of swearing in the Linux kernel source code over time

#72

Post by noworriesnate » Mon, Jun 16, 2025, 2:29 PM UTC

gspencley wrote: post #64

javcasas wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have never worked on a big corporation. But I find interesting about corporations forbidding swearwords in code. I mean, the people responsible for forbidding swearwords rarely read code. And if they read code with any frequency and are somewhat proficient at it, most likely they have their own list of swearwords. Also we should look to add more keywords to programming languages that trigger naïve filters. I'm all…

I don't personally care about language choices in code, but I'll play devil's advocate and speculate as to why a business might be concerned. 1. Reputational harm in the event that code needs to be shared. Say, the code gets read in court, or an outside consultant is brought in who is given access to the code. The company likely wants to maintain the same standard of professionalism that they expect when their employ…

Yeah I had a coworker who put salty MessageBox.Show debug messages in the code, and one day while demoing the software a pop up appeared that said “BITCH!!!”

Needless to say the customer was not amused. So the simple solution is just ban the bad words from the source code.

Re: Occurences of swearing in the Linux kernel source code over time

#73

Post by mcgrath_sh » Mon, Jun 16, 2025, 2:30 PM UTC

gspencley wrote: post #64

javcasas wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have never worked on a big corporation. But I find interesting about corporations forbidding swearwords in code. I mean, the people responsible for forbidding swearwords rarely read code. And if they read code with any frequency and are somewhat proficient at it, most likely they have their own list of swearwords. Also we should look to add more keywords to programming languages that trigger naïve filters. I'm all…

I don't personally care about language choices in code, but I'll play devil's advocate and speculate as to why a business might be concerned. 1. Reputational harm in the event that code needs to be shared. Say, the code gets read in court, or an outside consultant is brought in who is given access to the code. The company likely wants to maintain the same standard of professionalism that they expect when their employ…

I can swear a lot while talking. I have never written a curse word in my code, especially professionally. Just seems odd and not useful? I wouldn't be offended if I came across one, but it seems weird to use in a professional setting? A lot of the times I have seen inappropriate words used were not in any context and were used as a "joke" when logging/debugging. So "dicks 01" or "fuck me 01" instead of a bland "check 01" or whatever. For some reason, that seems much more unprofessional than a comment like "this code is shitty but works, need to clean up."

The contextless swearing seems so unnecessary and adds nothing to the code, whereas a comment with a curse word in it reads way more human.

Re: Occurences of swearing in the Linux kernel source code over time

#74

Post by Arainach » Mon, Jun 16, 2025, 2:30 PM UTC

rfrey wrote: post #62

Arainach wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hopefully in a few decades the last of the people who think that using respectful discourse means no fun can be had will be gone and we can stop rehashing these threads. You're contributing to something that runs on billions of devices across the world and is maintained by people around the world of all types. If you can't describe your code, your reasons, and your notes politely, do better.

I contend that you are slipping in the words "respectful" and "professional" and assuming the benefit of their positive connotations without an argument that simply omitting the occasional well-placed curse is indeed "professional". I think so-called "professional" speech - which I'd call bland and often ineffective speech - is professional in the same way that a suit and tie is professional. It's a uniform to ensure…

Cursing adds nothing to the code. "// Stupid fucking hack" is worse than "stupid hack" (more characters while conveying no extra information) and much worse than "work around Lotus 123 leap year calculation bug"

Re: Occurences of swearing in the Linux kernel source code over time

#75

Post by perching_aix » Mon, Jun 16, 2025, 2:31 PM UTC

javcasas wrote: post #42

holowoodman wrote: post #2

Theory: the shift towards lesser swearwords is a sign of corporatization, making the linux source a soulless bland hellscape of confirmity.

I have never worked on a big corporation. But I find interesting about corporations forbidding swearwords in code. I mean, the people responsible for forbidding swearwords rarely read code. And if they read code with any frequency and are somewhat proficient at it, most likely they have their own list of swearwords. Also we should look to add more keywords to programming languages that trigger naïve filters. I'm all…

> I mean, the people responsible for forbidding swearwords rarely read code.

Just plain not true.

Re: Occurences of swearing in the Linux kernel source code over time

#76

Post by Arainach » Mon, Jun 16, 2025, 2:33 PM UTC

holowoodman wrote: post #56

Arainach wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There are far more than two types; all of the most effective programmers I've ever worked with can do everything you mentioned and write professionally. If we have to boil it down to two types, however, I'd split it as "people who think they can do everything themselves and only the code matters" and "people who build effective teams capable of far more than themselves solo", and it's the second group that does the m…

I would say that a swearword where a swearword is due is actually effective and professional. Dancing around an issue and trying to be polite wastes time and effort, a well-placed swearword directs eyes, ears and effort to where they need to be.

It doesn't. There are words explicitly to draw attention. There's TODO and IMPORTANT and WARNING. A swear is inferior to any of these.

Re: Occurences of swearing in the Linux kernel source code over time

#77

Post by thfuran » Mon, Jun 16, 2025, 2:33 PM UTC

gspencley wrote: post #64

javcasas wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have never worked on a big corporation. But I find interesting about corporations forbidding swearwords in code. I mean, the people responsible for forbidding swearwords rarely read code. And if they read code with any frequency and are somewhat proficient at it, most likely they have their own list of swearwords. Also we should look to add more keywords to programming languages that trigger naïve filters. I'm all…

I don't personally care about language choices in code, but I'll play devil's advocate and speculate as to why a business might be concerned. 1. Reputational harm in the event that code needs to be shared. Say, the code gets read in court, or an outside consultant is brought in who is given access to the code. The company likely wants to maintain the same standard of professionalism that they expect when their employ…

>The idea that arbitrary sequences of phones or characters will cause anyone within ear or eye-shot to become offended is rather absurd.

No more absurd than the notion that a mere sequence of sounds could convey any other meaning or elicit any other response.

Re: Occurences of swearing in the Linux kernel source code over time

#78

Post by perching_aix » Mon, Jun 16, 2025, 2:34 PM UTC

GJim wrote: post #27

sschueller wrote: post #4

Retard may not be in there as a swear word. It could be a comment regarding a "delay". [1] [1] :to delay or impede the development or progress of : to slow up especially by preventing or hindering advance or accomplishment

It's baffling anybody would think otherwise. Reddit auto-censorship (and such auto censorship elsewhere) has a lot to answer for.

See the other comment where the guy mentions it's overwhelmingly used in a non-cursing manner, then the first hit is it being used as cursing.

Re: Occurences of swearing in the Linux kernel source code over time

#79

Post by mcgrath_sh » Mon, Jun 16, 2025, 2:36 PM UTC

noworriesnate wrote: post #72

gspencley wrote: post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't personally care about language choices in code, but I'll play devil's advocate and speculate as to why a business might be concerned. 1. Reputational harm in the event that code needs to be shared. Say, the code gets read in court, or an outside consultant is brought in who is given access to the code. The company likely wants to maintain the same standard of professionalism that they expect when their employ…

Yeah I had a coworker who put salty MessageBox.Show debug messages in the code, and one day while demoing the software a pop up appeared that said “BITCH!!!” Needless to say the customer was not amused. So the simple solution is just ban the bad words from the source code.

I wrote something similar in another comment. This is where I have seen curse words bite teams too. It is always the needless "joke" when debugging that surfaces. Just go boring. No one gets offended by "check 001."

Re: Occurences of swearing in the Linux kernel source code over time

#80

Post by perching_aix » Mon, Jun 16, 2025, 2:38 PM UTC

holowoodman wrote: post #2

Theory: the shift towards lesser swearwords is a sign of corporatization, making the linux source a soulless bland hellscape of confirmity.

> a soulless bland hellscape of confirmity.

I'll never understand this mentality. It's code, not some """self-expressionist""" art project.