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A lost decade chasing distributed architectures for data analytics?

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Re: A lost decade chasing distributed architectures for data analytics?

#71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you only have 1tb of data then you can have it in ram on a modern server.

In the last few years, sure, but certainly not in 2012.

1TB memory servers weren't THAT exotic even in say 2014~2018 era either, I know as I had a few at work.

Not cheap, but these were at companies with 100s of SWEs / billions in revenue / would eventually have multi-million dollar cloud bills for what little they migrated there.

Re: A lost decade chasing distributed architectures for data analytics?

#73
I have a large analytics dataset in BigQuery and I wrote an interactive exploratory UI on top of it and any query I did generally finished in 2s or less. This led to a very simple app with infinite analytics refinement that was also fast.

I would definitely not trade that for a pre-computed analytics approach. The freedom to explore in real time is enlightening and freeing.

I think you have restricted yourself to recomputed fix analytics but real time interactive analytics is also an interesting area.

Re: A lost decade chasing distributed architectures for data analytics?

#75
post #59

> History is full of “what if”s, what if something like DuckDB had existed in 2012? The main ingredients were there, vectorized query processing had already been invented in 2005. Would the now somewhat-silly-looking move to distributed systems for data analysis have ever happened? I like the gist of the article, but the conclusion sounds like 20/20 hindsight. All the elements were there, and the author nails it, but…

It will not happened. The problem is that people believe theirs app will be web-scale pretty-soon so need to solve the problem ASAP.

Is only after being burned many many times that arise the need for simplicity.

Is the same of NoSql. Only after suffer it you appreciate going back.

ie: Tools like this circle back only after the pain of a bubble. It can't be done inside it

Re: A lost decade chasing distributed architectures for data analytics?

#77
post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not sure I really follow, you can create new tables for any step if you want to do it entirely within the db, but you can also just run duckdb against your dataframes in memory.

In R, data sources, intermediate results, and final results are all dataframes (slight simplification). With DuckDB, to have the same consistency you need every layer and step to be a database table, not a data frame, which is awkward for the standard R user and use case.

You can also use duckplyr as a drop in replacing for dplyr. Automatically fails over to dplyr for unsupported behavior, and for most operations is notably faster.

Data.Table is competitive with DuckDb in many cases, though as a DuckDB enthusiast I hate to admit this. :)

Re: A lost decade chasing distributed architectures for data analytics?

#78
post #69
post #68

This makes a completely valid point when you constrain the meaning of Big Data to “the largest dataset one can fit on a single computer”.

At companies I've worked at "Big Data" was often used to mean "too big to open in Excel" or in the extreme case "too big to fit in RAM on my laptop"

Annoyingly medium data is my term for this.

Around 0.5 to 50 GB is such an annoying area, because Excel starts falling over on the lower end and even nicer computers will start seriously struggling on the larger end if you're not being extremely efficient.

Re: A lost decade chasing distributed architectures for data analytics?

#79
post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Maybe it was all VC funded solutions looking for problems? Remember, from 2020-2023 we had an entire movement to push a thing called "Modern data stack (MDS)" with big actors like a16z lecturing the market about it [1]. I am originally from Data. Never worked with anything out of the Data: DS, MLE, DE, MLOps and so on. One thing that I envy from other developer careers is to have bosses/leaders that had battle-test…

Right.. shove your data in our data platform. OK now you need PortCo1's company analytics platform, PortCo2's orchestration platform, PortCo3's SRE platform, PortCo4's Auth platform, PortCo5's IaC platform, PortCo6's Secrets Mgmt Platform, PortoCo7's infosec platform, etc. I am sure I forgot another 10 things. Even if some of these things were open source or "open source", there was the upsell to the managed/supporte…

This is the primary failure of data platforms from my perspective. You need too many 3rd parties/partners to actually get anything done with your data and costs become unbearable.

Re: A lost decade chasing distributed architectures for data analytics?

#80
This is really a question of economics. The biggest organizations with the most ability to hire engineers have need for technologies that can solve their existing problems in incremental ways, and thus we end up with horrible technologies like Hadoop and Iceberg. They end up hiring talented engineers to work on niche problems, and a lot of the technical discourse ends up revolving around technologies that don't apply to the majority of organizations, but still cause FOMO amongst them. I, for one, am extremely happy to see technologies like DuckDB come along to serve the long tail.
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