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The 'Judicial Black Hole' of El Salvador's Prisons Is a Warning for Americans
71–80 of 223 posts
Re: The 'Judicial Black Hole' of El Salvador's Prisons Is a Warning for Americans
#72Earlier quoted context omitted.
It’s worth a debate, even though in American culture we hold this idea as beyond any consideration. Benjamin Franklin is quoted as saying "it is better 100 guilty Persons should escape than that one innocent Person should suffer". That's a noble thought, but those 100 criminals can cause suffering of 100s of others. So his assessment isn't necessarily accurate. Every innocent father jailed in El Salvador might save 1…
Note that Franklin was the product of a society that had been executing felons for hundreds of years. The homicide rate in both England and New England in the early 1700s was around 2 per 100,000, lower than any western hemisphere country today.
Canada's is less than 2 per 100k
https://www150.statcan.gc.ca/t1/tbl1/en/tv.action?pid=351000...
I also have to doubt the accuracy of such data collected in the 1700s.
Re: The 'Judicial Black Hole' of El Salvador's Prisons Is a Warning for Americans
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Re: The 'Judicial Black Hole' of El Salvador's Prisons Is a Warning for Americans
#74I don't think many people have actually contemplated what absence of law, defined as rules that apply to rich and powerful people too, is like. In a world with law, there are restriction on what society's most powerful can and can't do, because there are police officers, detectives, lawyers, and judges, who all work together to make sure there are consequences for crimes. In a world without law, the only restriction…
>I don't think many people have actually contemplated what absence of law, defined as rules that apply to rich and powerful people too, is like.
Maybe not many people in the US have, but people in CCP China are plenty familiar. That is an example of "rule of the people" instead of "rule of law". Remember the melanmine milk scandal? Barely a slap on the wrist for Sanlu (the vendor). Or, did anything happen after the child molestation incident at a Beijing kindergarten?
Re: The 'Judicial Black Hole' of El Salvador's Prisons Is a Warning for Americans
#75Heh, even the extrajudicial imprisonment camps can be outsourced now. Why look bad having your military run Guantanamo when you can do the Uber model it for a cheap price. Heh, or is a pun on AirBnB the more apt name for it.. "Concrete Floor & Indefinite Detention"?
Reminds me more of the Amazon Delivery Partner model where the way you want to do something implies harming innocent people, so you have a third-party do it to shift blame for the deaths.
Re: The 'Judicial Black Hole' of El Salvador's Prisons Is a Warning for Americans
#76Heh, even the extrajudicial imprisonment camps can be outsourced now. Why look bad having your military run Guantanamo when you can do the Uber model it for a cheap price. Heh, or is a pun on AirBnB the more apt name for it.. "Concrete Floor & Indefinite Detention"?
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Re: The 'Judicial Black Hole' of El Salvador's Prisons Is a Warning for Americans
#77Earlier quoted context omitted.
It’s worth a debate, even though in American culture we hold this idea as beyond any consideration. Benjamin Franklin is quoted as saying "it is better 100 guilty Persons should escape than that one innocent Person should suffer". That's a noble thought, but those 100 criminals can cause suffering of 100s of others. So his assessment isn't necessarily accurate. Every innocent father jailed in El Salvador might save 1…
Note that Franklin was the product of a society that had been executing felons for hundreds of years. The homicide rate in both England and New England in the early 1700s was around 2 per 100,000, lower than any western hemisphere country today.
Where did you get that figure from?
There are many sources online that agree, so I won’t bother to link them, that the population of New England was ~100k in 1700 and ~300k in 1750.
The claim that that actual rate of murder in all of New England was 2-6 per year is not believable.
Re: The 'Judicial Black Hole' of El Salvador's Prisons Is a Warning for Americans
#78The homicide rate in El Salvador has dropped from 100 per 100,000 to 2.5 per 100,000 in just a decade: https://www.statista.com/statistics/696152/homicide-rate-in-... . The El Salvadoran government has literally brought the country to an entirely different level of development, vastly improving the lives of most of the country’s 6 million people. Disorder and dysfunction doesn’t just hurt those who are killed. It’s a…
Sending people there and then saying you don't have jurisdiction over them anymore is dysfunctional by any reasonable measure.
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Re: The 'Judicial Black Hole' of El Salvador's Prisons Is a Warning for Americans
#79Earlier quoted context omitted.
You skipped the bit at the front: > Whenever there is a declared war between the United States and any foreign nation or government, or any invasion or predatory incursion is perpetrated, attempted, or threatened against the territory of the United States by any foreign nation or government, and the President makes public proclamation of the event https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/50/21 Which nation is invading…
There are a lot of “ors” and commas in that law, but it’s not hard to parse unless you’re being willfully obtuse. ((Declared war OR (invasion OR predatory incursion)) IS (perpetrated OR attempted OR threatened)) BY (foreign nation OR foreign government). The law was drafted in the early 18th century when nation was more of an ethnographic term than a political one. So "a predatory invasion threatened by Venezuelans"…
There is clear legislative intent to limit when the president could apply the law. You're suggesting limitations set by congress are meaningless, so long as the president's staff can form some sort of argument by stretching the facts enough.
Edit: typo
Re: The 'Judicial Black Hole' of El Salvador's Prisons Is a Warning for Americans
#80The homicide rate in El Salvador has dropped from 100 per 100,000 to 2.5 per 100,000 in just a decade: https://www.statista.com/statistics/696152/homicide-rate-in-... . The El Salvadoran government has literally brought the country to an entirely different level of development, vastly improving the lives of most of the country’s 6 million people. Disorder and dysfunction doesn’t just hurt those who are killed. It’s a…
Sending people there and then saying you don't have jurisdiction over them anymore is dysfunctional by any reasonable measure.
Writing from a country with dysfunctional judiciary, I think this is a logical way to overcome crime, at least temporarily. There isn't a "hygienic" alternative when judges are continuously bribed or blackmailed by gang members.