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Why I run FreeBSD for my home servers (2024)

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Re: Why I run FreeBSD for my home servers (2024)

#71
post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The only thing I currently run on FreeBSD is my storage box. ZFS is absolutely amazing, and FreeBSD supports it fully and without any of the "jank" you'd get running ZFS on Linux. It Just Works (tm), bottom to top. Anything else, I want what I'm familiar with on Linux, like containers and systemd services. I know some people really love pf, but I've been using iptables for so long it would be annoying to switch at th…

> ZFS is absolutely amazing, and FreeBSD supports it fully and without any of the "jank" you'd get running ZFS on Linux. This is why I use FreeBSD as well for my home server, first class ZFS support out of the box. Void Linux musl on my desktop. I had an old 2TB ZFS array that was part of a trunas setup kicking around for years. I needed to recover some files from it so I hooked all the disks to a motherboard and boo…

ZFS is a first-class citizen on Void Linux, too. There's a lot of care and consideration put into the kernel packages to ensure compatibility with ZFS. ZFSBootMenu is 'native' to Void as well, and the features it provides are quite far ahead of what FreeBSD's bootloader has.

Re: Why I run FreeBSD for my home servers (2024)

#72
post #46

Alpine, Void, Devuan or Artix all would have allowed author to use Linux while addressing his points of concern. I don't think the BSD's have real advantages anymore since so much core performance stuff is in Linux first. When most of the software is available on all these platforms, it mostly comes down to user preference.

I run Linux, macOS, FreeBSD, and SmartOS/illumos in various capacities personal and professional. Each has its own strengths, but I choose FreeBSD for home servers (shared file/media server. and network gateway), for a few specific reasons: - ZFS (on root, fully integrated tooling for jails, etc) - More consistency/less churn in base system (great for set-and-forget systems) - Ports/pkg (still better than any Linux p…

The first two are the exact reason I run FreeBSD on my home servers, too.

Re: Why I run FreeBSD for my home servers (2024)

#74
post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have had BSD as my router for a few years in the past and used Linux for a few decades but I never got this “BSD is cleaner” argument. Linux has man pages and Google gives you plenty more practical resources when in doubt and nothing felt unstable compared to “BSD is more tightly integrated” statement. Lack of community resource such as documents, blogs, StackOverflow answers and docker ecosystem just drove me away…

Maybe "cleaner" really means "more uniform", compared to the wide variety of Linux distros and their incompatibilities? Or like the word "intuitive", really just means "what I'm used to".

More uniform most likely. With FreeBSD can google some issue you’re encountering and the solutions you find are likely to be applicable, even with differing hardware, OS version, etc.

With Linux there’s been many times I’ll google some problem and the only solution that turns up is for distro Y which is mostly or entirely irrelevant to distro X that I’m running at the moment. This happens even with the big mainstream distros like Ubuntu and Fedora, but of course it’s worse with more niche ones.

Re: Why I run FreeBSD for my home servers (2024)

#75

Curious what “home servers” are really for. I’ve gone decades without needing a home server — what am I missing out on?

Mine is running, in no particular order:

* UrBackup for all of the host systems in the home to backup to

* Plex for home movies

* HomeAssistant

* OpenThread Border Router

* Zigbee2MQTT

* Matter Server

* PostgreSQL (for HA)

* InfluxDB (for long term statistics from HA)

* EMHASS (linear optimizer to maximise profit on my Solar PV + Battery system)

* Minecraft server for the kids

* Mosquitto MQTT broker

* TeslaMate for car data

In my case, the heaviest use is HomeAssistant - every light in the house has smarts, either directly, or through smart relays. Telling my energy provider how much charge to add to the EV's so they schedule it and I only pay 7p per kWh during the dispatching windows. Managing energy flow in the house (charge battery? discharge battery? only charge battery from solar that would otherwise be curtailed due to a 5kW export limit) etc. etc.

It's running in a short depth 2U rackmount chassis inside my network rack, with 6 4TB drives running in RaidZ2 and offsite backups which are aided by a 1Gbps symmetric FTTP connection.

Re: Why I run FreeBSD for my home servers (2024)

#76
Look, as someone running a mix of bsd and linux machines...

The only salient point in this entire article is that BSD typically is less convoluted as a system (and as a consequence... usually less capable and less supported).

I find absolutely all of the other points to be "easy cop outs". They're there to provide him a mental justification for doing the thing he wants to do anyways, without actually justifying his logic or challenging any assumptions.

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Case in point - I used to point all (most of) my hosted services at a single database. It genuinely sucked. It's a larger backup, it's a larger restore, if it goes down everything is down, and you better hope all the software you're hosting supports your preferred DB (hah - they won't, half will use postgres, half will use mysql, and half of the mysql half will actually be using mariadb, and I'm ignoring the annoying group that won't properly support a networked db at all and don't understand why I'm frustrated they only support sqlite).

You know the only thing it was actually doing for me? Marginally simplifying deployment, usually at first time setup.

You know what else the author of this post is trashing? Some pretty good tools for simplifying deployments.

Turns out... if spinning up a database is 3-10 lines in a config file, and automatic backups are super simple to configure with your deployment tool (see - all those k8s things he's bashing)... You don't even feel this pain at all.

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Basically - This is a lazy argument.

Perfectly fine personal preference (I also sometimes enjoy the simplicity of my freeBSD machines, and I run opnsense for a reason).

But a trash argument against the things he's railing against.

Switching to k3s and running kubernetes was a a pretty giant time sink to get online (think maybe 25 hours) - but since it's come online... I've never had an easier time managing my home services.

Deployment is SO fucking simple, no one machine going down takes any service down, I get automatic backups, easy storage monitoring (longhorn and NAS), I can configure easy policies to reboot services, or manage their lifecycles, I can provision another machine for the cluster in under 10 minutes, and then it just works (including GPU accelerated workloads).

These days... It's been so long since I've ssh'd into some of my machines that I occasionally have to think for a minute before I remember the hostname.

I don't think about most of them AT ALL - they just fucking work (tm).

I remember the before times - personally, I don't want to go back. It's never been easier to run your own cloud - I currently have 112 online pods across 37 services. I don't restart jack shit on my own - the system runs itself.

Everything from video streaming to LLM inference to simple wikis and bookstack.

Re: Why I run FreeBSD for my home servers (2024)

#77
post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Postmarket actually wound up porting systemd somewhat recently. https://postmarketos.org/blog/2024/03/05/adding-systemd/

Not by choice. > This is of course not an easy task, one of the main blockers we found as we collaborate more closely with KDE and GNOME developers is that they have a hard time with our OpenRC-based stack. In order to get KDE Plasma and GNOME working at all, we use a lot of systemd polyfills on top of OpenRC.

I don't particularly care about those details. I was mostly pointing out to the parent commenter that it does exist there now.

Re: Why I run FreeBSD for my home servers (2024)

#78

I notice FreeBSD admins tend to follow a 'pets not cattle' approach, carefully nurturing individual systems. Linux admins like myself typically prefer the 'cattle not pets' mindset—using infrastructure-as-code where if a server dies, no problem, just spin up another one. Leverage containers. Statelessness. I don't want to spend time meticulously configuring things beyond the core infrastructure my services run on. I…

> I notice FreeBSD admins tend to follow a 'pets not cattle' approach, carefully nurturing individual systems. Linux admins like myself typically prefer the 'cattle not pets' mindset—using infrastructure-as-code where if a server dies, no problem, just spin up another one.

I've worked at 'pets not cattle' and 'cattle not pets', and I vastly prefer pets. Yes, you should be able to easily bring up a new pet when you need to; yes, it must be ok if pet1 goes away, never to be seen again. But no, it's not really ok when your servers have an average lifetime of 30 days. It's very hard to offer a stable service on an unstable substrate. Automatic recovery makes sense in some cases, but if the system stops working, there's a problem that needs to be addressed when possible.

> All this being said, I have this romantic draw to FreeBSD and want to play around with it more. But every time I set up a basic box I feel teleported back to 2007.

Like another poster mentioned; this is actually a good thing. FreeBSD respects your investment in knowledge; everything you learned in 2007 still works, and most likely will continue to work. You won't need to learn a new firewall tool every decade, whichever of the three firewalls you like will keep working. You don't need to learn a new tool to configure interfaces, ifconfig will keep working. You don't need to learn a new tool to get network statistics, netstat will keep working. Etc.

Re: Why I run FreeBSD for my home servers (2024)

#79
post #8

I notice FreeBSD admins tend to follow a 'pets not cattle' approach, carefully nurturing individual systems. Linux admins like myself typically prefer the 'cattle not pets' mindset—using infrastructure-as-code where if a server dies, no problem, just spin up another one. Leverage containers. Statelessness. I don't want to spend time meticulously configuring things beyond the core infrastructure my services run on. I…

The only thing I currently run on FreeBSD is my storage box. ZFS is absolutely amazing, and FreeBSD supports it fully and without any of the "jank" you'd get running ZFS on Linux. It Just Works (tm), bottom to top. Anything else, I want what I'm familiar with on Linux, like containers and systemd services. I know some people really love pf, but I've been using iptables for so long it would be annoying to switch at th…

ZFS works on Ubuntu top to the bottom too. It’s installed with a command.

Re: Why I run FreeBSD for my home servers (2024)

#80
post #64
post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> In my experience, systemd is far better and more reliable than anything else, especially if you need complex logic The author is talking about home servers that do not need the complex logic.

Basic systemd is really not that complex.

I think the author's point is that systemd by itself is complex, and it doesn't matter if you use it in a simple configuration, or in a more complex one.
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