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"the Zooms don't show up" Jamie Dimon

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Re: "the Zooms don't show up" Jamie Dimon

#71

Post by lotsofpulp »

dijksterhuis wrote: post #12
jauntywundrkind wrote: post #5

We have some really phoning it in zoom folks we've hired who do their job semi ok but are just awful and don't contribute to culture, are super dialed out. I don't want to totally damn them, because they have families and lives and other things going. But I've had a number of coworkers tell me they have re-adapted their code review to say near nothing (it won't be well received) and to otherwise end their own good-cu…

i sort of agree wit your sentiment, although probably would use more nuanced language about it. i’ve had this exact conversation with my 70+ still working father so many times now. i’ve heard the rant in the article over and over again. and, like, he blames remote work too. “its the fucking zoom bullshit”. but then i explain to him how i do remote work and suddenly gets it. like, remote working means you are required…

> i’ve had this exact conversation with my 70+ still working father so many times now.

> but then i explain to him how i do remote work and suddenly gets it.

I don’t understand how he gets it if you have to have the same conversation numerous times.

Re: "the Zooms don't show up" Jamie Dimon

#72

Post by HDThoreaun »

alanfranz wrote: post #64
asimpleusecase wrote: post #61

We have a small team that is remote by design. Yet everyone has commented that those rare times we can gather see massive uplift in productivity. For us being in a central location is not possible. But for companies with an office building I can see the human dynamic of being together is very powerful. Even with all the chat, trackers, conference tools etc “context” is the hardest thing to do remotely.

Honest question: in which way does productivity improve? Is that measurable? Or is that just a well-being feeling for meeting colleagues IRL? In day to day remote work do you work together, or is it fully async with some chat-only meetings?

My teams velocity increased when we started doing hybrid instead of full remote. Of course thats not proof of anything as our jira points arent objective but it definitely lines up with feeling more productive. We were pretty async while remote. I dont think remote without productivity loss is impossible, but you need very skilled managers and most companies dont have those.

Re: "the Zooms don't show up" Jamie Dimon

#73

Post by rcarmo »

HDThoreaun wrote: post #72
alanfranz wrote: post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Honest question: in which way does productivity improve? Is that measurable? Or is that just a well-being feeling for meeting colleagues IRL? In day to day remote work do you work together, or is it fully async with some chat-only meetings?

My teams velocity increased when we started doing hybrid instead of full remote. Of course thats not proof of anything as our jira points arent objective but it definitely lines up with feeling more productive. We were pretty async while remote. I dont think remote without productivity loss is impossible, but you need very skilled managers and most companies dont have those.

You had less meetings.

Re: "the Zooms don't show up" Jamie Dimon

#74

Post by rcarmo »

dijksterhuis wrote: post #42
greesil wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What I've noticed is that people don't seem to have the attention span to read the document or memo I wrote, and the meeting is so they can get the TL;DR.

oh god yeah these people do my head in. i haven’t found a good strategy for them yet.

The Amazon Way used to be for you to send out a memo so that people would be productive at a meeting, and cancel the meeting on the spot if more than a third hadn’t read it or read enough of it.

Re: "the Zooms don't show up" Jamie Dimon

#75

Post by dijksterhuis »

lotsofpulp wrote: post #71
dijksterhuis wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

i sort of agree wit your sentiment, although probably would use more nuanced language about it. i’ve had this exact conversation with my 70+ still working father so many times now. i’ve heard the rant in the article over and over again. and, like, he blames remote work too. “its the fucking zoom bullshit”. but then i explain to him how i do remote work and suddenly gets it. like, remote working means you are required…

> i’ve had this exact conversation with my 70+ still working father so many times now. > but then i explain to him how i do remote work and suddenly gets it. I don’t understand how he gets it if you have to have the same conversation numerous times.

he gets it on that call.... then he gets pissed off about it all over the next few months after he's forgotten our call about it. then he complains about it on the phone to me. then i remind him, then he remembers or i explain it again.

repeat.

Re: "the Zooms don't show up" Jamie Dimon

#76

Post by SoftTalker »

OutOfHere wrote: post #62
SoftTalker wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Phones are an addiction. I know executives who have a box outside the conference room and everyone has to put their phone in the box as they enter the meeting. They pick up their phone on the way out.

I am not going to allow anyone else to touch my phone, even by mistake. In fact it is zipped to my clothing, so I don't lose it by accident either. If I were to leave it in a box, if will definitely get lost one day.

Well I’m sure it would be acceptable to lock your phone in your desk and not bring it to the meeting at all

Re: "the Zooms don't show up" Jamie Dimon

#77

Post by greesil »

rcarmo wrote: post #74
dijksterhuis wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

oh god yeah these people do my head in. i haven’t found a good strategy for them yet.

The Amazon Way used to be for you to send out a memo so that people would be productive at a meeting, and cancel the meeting on the spot if more than a third hadn’t read it or read enough of it.

"used to"? What do they do now?

Re: "the Zooms don't show up" Jamie Dimon

#78

Post by alanfranz »

HDThoreaun wrote: post #72
alanfranz wrote: post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Honest question: in which way does productivity improve? Is that measurable? Or is that just a well-being feeling for meeting colleagues IRL? In day to day remote work do you work together, or is it fully async with some chat-only meetings?

My teams velocity increased when we started doing hybrid instead of full remote. Of course thats not proof of anything as our jira points arent objective but it definitely lines up with feeling more productive. We were pretty async while remote. I dont think remote without productivity loss is impossible, but you need very skilled managers and most companies dont have those.

Personal opinion: I think more sync work is needed even when remote. Making all work async makes things harder, not working remotely.
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