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Why aren't we all serverless yet?

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Re: Why aren't we all serverless yet?

#71
Simple monoliths are much easier to reason about and debug. And the costs are much easier to estimate.

Serverless functions are quite interesting for certain use cases, but those are mostly additions to the main application. I'd hesitate to build a typical web application with mostly CRUD around serverless, it's just more complexity I don't need. But for handling jobs that are potentially resource intensive or that come in bursts something like Lambda would be a good fit.

Re: Why aren't we all serverless yet?

#73
post #10

This misses the main factor, I think: Vendor lock-in. There is no unification of APIs - every provider has their own bespoke abstractions typically requiring heavy integration into further vendor-specific services - moreso if you are to leverage USPs. Testing and reproducing locally is usually a pipe-dream (or take significantly more effort than the production deploy). Migrating to a different cloud usually requires…

Google cloud run and Azure container apps both let you run an arbitrary docker image without having to deal with custom setups. Both scale automatically so they are serverless. AWS has apprunner but it doesn't scale to zero.[0]

[0] https://github.com/aws/apprunner-roadmap/issues/9 (amusingly the issue OP posts on HN)

Re: Why aren't we all serverless yet?

#75

Serverless doesn’t mean no-server. It means someone else’s server. Their system. Their rules. Their way or the highway. No thank you.

I hate the term "serverless". It's a misnomer to the extent that it feels like it was designed to deliberately mislead. Even vague consultant-speak like "externally provisioned infrastructure" would feel more accurate.

It seems it is only a misnomer if you are too young to remember how these types of applications used to be written. They weren't always servers. In the early days they were subprocess modules[1]. "Serverless" is a return to the subprocess model, seeing the application lose the server, or to put it another way the application is less a server.

This must be why they say programming is dead once you turn 40: You can no longer communicate with the young-ins.

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Common_Gateway_Interface

Re: Why aren't we all serverless yet?

#76
post #66
post #10

This misses the main factor, I think: Vendor lock-in. There is no unification of APIs - every provider has their own bespoke abstractions typically requiring heavy integration into further vendor-specific services - moreso if you are to leverage USPs. Testing and reproducing locally is usually a pipe-dream (or take significantly more effort than the production deploy). Migrating to a different cloud usually requires…

I’m building a serverless platform with the familiar interface of Kubernetes: https://kapycluster.com . Does this fit your expectations?

It does look like it! Personally I'm off the k8s train and don't currently have a use-case but best of luck!

feedback: why make a clear distinction between "magic node" and "BYON"? Two new concepts to learn when I feel a value-prop for some users would be to not have think about these distinctions? (Just talking about wording and communication here - can you get the value prop across with less reification?)

Re: Why aren't we all serverless yet?

#77
post #10

This misses the main factor, I think: Vendor lock-in. There is no unification of APIs - every provider has their own bespoke abstractions typically requiring heavy integration into further vendor-specific services - moreso if you are to leverage USPs. Testing and reproducing locally is usually a pipe-dream (or take significantly more effort than the production deploy). Migrating to a different cloud usually requires…

Google cloud run and Azure container apps both let you run an arbitrary docker image without having to deal with custom setups. Both scale automatically so they are serverless. AWS has apprunner but it doesn't scale to zero.[0] [0] https://github.com/aws/apprunner-roadmap/issues/9 (amusingly the issue OP posts on HN)

Lambda does as well. You can even use their runtime interface client to run your function within the same wrapped that Lambda uses irl

Re: Why aren't we all serverless yet?

#79
post #77

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Google cloud run and Azure container apps both let you run an arbitrary docker image without having to deal with custom setups. Both scale automatically so they are serverless. AWS has apprunner but it doesn't scale to zero.[0] [0] https://github.com/aws/apprunner-roadmap/issues/9 (amusingly the issue OP posts on HN)

Lambda does as well. You can even use their runtime interface client to run your function within the same wrapped that Lambda uses irl

Can I upload my web server as a docker to Lambda and have it run forever there? I though Lambdas were supposed to be more short lived (like a couple hours), is that not the case? It's been a while since I actually looked at Lambda because GCP run is so clean.

Re: Why aren't we all serverless yet?

#80
post #76
post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’m building a serverless platform with the familiar interface of Kubernetes: https://kapycluster.com . Does this fit your expectations?

It does look like it! Personally I'm off the k8s train and don't currently have a use-case but best of luck! feedback: why make a clear distinction between "magic node" and "BYON"? Two new concepts to learn when I feel a value-prop for some users would be to not have think about these distinctions? (Just talking about wording and communication here - can you get the value prop across with less reification?)

Thanks for the feedback! I’ve been thinking about the wording too—and you might be right, perhaps highlighting the Magic Node as the mainstay vs BYON being a smaller, side feature might help sell the main value prop. I’ll try clearing that up!

Thanks again!

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