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Docker Compose Isn't Enough

blog.tealok.tech

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Re: Docker Compose Isn't Enough

#71

Post by pjmlp »

Izkata wrote: post #8

I've always understood docker-compose to be a development or personal tool, not for production. Is that not usually the case? Also aside, "docker compose" (V2) is different from "docker-compose" (V1) [0], it was rewritten and integrated into docker as a plugin. It should still be able to handle most old compose files, but there were some changes. [0] https://docs.docker.com/compose/releases/migrate/

Same here, we never use compose in production.

There is already a third version of compose.

Re: Docker Compose Isn't Enough

#72

Post by chipdart »

ricw wrote: post #28
Izkata wrote: post #8

I've always understood docker-compose to be a development or personal tool, not for production. Is that not usually the case? Also aside, "docker compose" (V2) is different from "docker-compose" (V1) [0], it was rewritten and integrated into docker as a plugin. It should still be able to handle most old compose files, but there were some changes. [0] https://docs.docker.com/compose/releases/migrate/

it's perfectly fine if everything can run on a single server instance. which is probably the majority of things. i've run production instances with 2PB of data being scraped per month by 100+ CPUs and 256GB of RAM using docker compose. some of the machines (smaller instances) have run flawlessly with zero reboots for years on end. both on cloud and on-prem. i'd say its 100% production ready.

> I'd say its 100% production ready.

That's fine. Some people also manually launch containers individually with Docker as their production system.

They'd be wasting their time and making their lives needlessly harder, though.

They already have tools that do all the legwork for them. Why not do the research and opt to force a square peg into a round hole?

Research Docker swarm mode, reverse proxies like Traefik, and Let's Encrypt. Kubernetes can be even easier with implementations like microk8s, which are a snap away from any Ubuntu installation. Look at what you're doing and figure out the right tool for the job. Don't just whine about how you're doing something wrong and it's the tool that needs to change to fix your own mistakes.

Re: Docker Compose Isn't Enough

#73

Post by echoangle »

I don’t get why docker doesn’t include a simple command (docker backup volumexyz mybackup.tar.gz) that creates an archive from a volume. Why do I have to do that myself by mounting the volume in a second container? Ok, there might be volumes that can’t be backed up (mounted sockets for example), but that could just give an error message.

Re: Docker Compose Isn't Enough

#74

Post by echoangle »

tommica wrote: post #60
zemo wrote: post #20

people dramatically overestimate how difficult it is to write a program that controls docker for you. This is one of those things where you can write like two pages of Python and ignore... all this: > Tealok is a runtime we’re building for running containers. If you have one machine and docker-compose is falling short, really, just write a Python script with the official docker Python package, you'll be fine.

Do you have some reference that you can link to? Would be curious to see something about this

Here’s the python module you would use: https://docker-py.readthedocs.io/en/stable/

Re: Docker Compose Isn't Enough

#75

Post by forrestthewoods »

shiroiushi wrote: post #66
forrestthewoods wrote: post #39

Containers were a mistake. This is all radically more complicated than it needs to be. Running a computer program is not that complicated.

Containers are a convenient work-around for the problem where programs have incompatible dependencies, and additionally the problem where security isn't as good as it should be. For instance, you want to run one program that was written for Python 3.y, but also another program written for Python 3.z. You might be able to just install 3.z and have them both work, but it's not guaranteed. Worse, your OS version only co…

> For instance, you want to run one program that was written for Python 3.y, but also another program written for Python 3.z. You might be able to just install 3.z and have them both work, but it's not guaranteed. Worse, your OS version only comes with version 3.x and upgrading is painful.

This is because the Linux model of global system wide shared dependencies is stupid, bad, and wrong. Docker and friends are a roundabout a way of having a program shipping its dependencies.

Re: Docker Compose Isn't Enough

#76

Post by theshrike79 »

forrestthewoods wrote: post #53
revskill wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is an abstraction.

Many abstractions are very bad. Stacking bad abstractions on bad abstractions is why modern software is so slow, laggy, and bloated.

What would be your solution to running, say, 15 different Python applications on the same machine, each requiring a unique set of library versions?

Re: Docker Compose Isn't Enough

#77

Post by wink »

chipdart wrote: post #72
ricw wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

it's perfectly fine if everything can run on a single server instance. which is probably the majority of things. i've run production instances with 2PB of data being scraped per month by 100+ CPUs and 256GB of RAM using docker compose. some of the machines (smaller instances) have run flawlessly with zero reboots for years on end. both on cloud and on-prem. i'd say its 100% production ready.

> I'd say its 100% production ready. That's fine. Some people also manually launch containers individually with Docker as their production system. They'd be wasting their time and making their lives needlessly harder, though. They already have tools that do all the legwork for them. Why not do the research and opt to force a square peg into a round hole? Research Docker swarm mode, reverse proxies like Traefik, and L…

Not sure what axe you have to grind, but the person you replied to didn't whine about anything as far as I can see. I've also been hosting a lot of stuff on docker-compose and it is perfectly fine for a lot of things. No one said it's perfect or does everything.

Re: Docker Compose Isn't Enough

#79

Post by wink »

czhu12 wrote: post #7

Shameless plug: I’m building https://canine.sh as a way of turning any managed kubernetes cluster into something as easy to use as Heroku. It’s been super frustrating in the past to be stuck on expensive PaaS vendors, but then rolling a deployment solution from scratch ended up with us trying to stitch together GitHub actions. Been just using canine for my own projects and I’ve been able to host 4 rails & 1 Rust app…

How would you rate the "overhead" of your tool+k8s (also wht specs does your server have?) because my main use for docker-compose so far has been "host a ton of small apps on 5EUR hetzner instances with just 2GB RAM". If I had a beefier box I'd probably tried k8s again but in my recollection of when I last used it was bad if you had e.g. 5x 2GB RAM/2 CPU vs 1x 8GB RAM on one box.
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