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Are We Anti-Cheat Yet?

areweanticheatyet.com

71–80 of 197 posts

Re: Are We Anti-Cheat Yet?

#71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's why I said the user has to explicitly accept that.

Who do you think downloads and runs malware? Users.

By the same argument we should prevents the users from running any program at all because it might be malware.

Re: Are We Anti-Cheat Yet?

#72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Cheats run on the cheater's machine, not on the other players' machines. Of course the cheater would always click accept because it's not an accident that the cheat is running on their machine.

It's not the cheat that has to be accepted, it is the game. The option prevents the cheats (or any other program) from being able to examine the game's memory.

Because the user controls their own machine, so they can open a hex editor and turn your option off.

Re: Are We Anti-Cheat Yet?

#73
What an interesting day when you see a site you've worked on for the past 2 (3?) years get posted to HN! Except I tried submitting this site years ago when I had just finished it, but it did not seem like HN was that interested at the time, and I don't blame them. It was very niche and video game related, and the site also looked a lot worse. It's come a long way to the point where there where I collaborated with someone else to do a redesign, which I think has done great for the project at large.

I originally created the site as a way to track which games would be supported on Linux, since at the time the Steam Deck was releasing, and some games were turning to support it. And it has since blossomed into a larger project, which some other tools even pull from! I would have never even imagined that when I first started making this.

I do want to address something I see being talked about in the comments, which is the fact people say that anti-cheats are snake oil, or useless. This is a big misunderstanding, and I feel like those more technically inclined should understand that anti-cheat is a "defense-in-depth" type of approach. Where it is just one of many lines of defense. Some anti-cheats are pretty useless, and don't do much, but some actually do try and protect the game you're playing. But, just like DRM, it can be cracked, and that's why it's more of a constant arms race, rather than a one and done thing.

I'm writing out a longer post about this for the future, but just know that without anti-cheat clientside, it would be far too easy for an attacker to cheat in these games. We're still ways out from letting AI (see VACnet [1] and and Anybrain [2]) determine if someone is cheating server-side, so for now we have to rely on heavier client-side techniques and server-side decision making.

Also if anyone has questions about the site (or for me), I'll try to answer them here when I see them. If not, have a nice day!

[1] https://youtu.be/kTiP0zKF9bc

[2] https://www.anybrain.gg/

Re: Are We Anti-Cheat Yet?

#74
the best anti cheat that i have experience is vangaurd by riot games. I was running a python script in background for web crawling, left it on and guess what? my account got banned. the support says the vangaurd found a script running. i explained them patiently that it was a web crawling script , still no use.

Re: Are We Anti-Cheat Yet?

#75
post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not the cheat that has to be accepted, it is the game. The option prevents the cheats (or any other program) from being able to examine the game's memory.

Because the user controls their own machine, so they can open a hex editor and turn your option off.

Well I assume there are ways to prevent that (or make it extremely difficult at least)? E.g. look at denuvo, nobody has been able to "open a hex editor" and disable denuvo.

Re: Are We Anti-Cheat Yet?

#76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Cheats run on the cheater's machine, not on the other players' machines. Of course the cheater would always click accept because it's not an accident that the cheat is running on their machine.

It's not the cheat that has to be accepted, it is the game. The option prevents the cheats (or any other program) from being able to examine the game's memory.

You would need to get rid of kernel level drivers for that to work. Which right now would completely disable any security software. But if it's ever done yeah this wouldn't be such a bad idea to isolate apps. However any security API would still have to allow read only access, which would be enough for most cheats, and by design blocking this type of access should never be possible since antivirus/EDR will need this.

Re: Are We Anti-Cheat Yet?

#77

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But are cheaters even an issue in unpopular games that don't give out real money for tournaments ? I have never seen cheaters being an issue (even the few times people set up tournaments with prizes), which makes me think that this might be limited to very few games (in very specific genres) ?

> But are cheaters even an issue in unpopular games Yes. Every game has cheats. The cheat packages are pretty easy to adapt to new games and people pay money for them. Why do people cheat? Because it’s fun! If you’ve never cheated it’s honestly worth trying. It’s hilarious. It also utterly ruins the game for everyone else in the lobby. If games had reliable anti-cheat you’d be shocked at the percentage of lobbies tha…

I'm not talking about developer tools - cheats that come with the game, available in single player (and multiplayer if the host allows it).

But a lot of games do also have accessible to everyone replays that show every order given by every player, so catching a cheater that acted on information not available to them (because for instance they had buddies in other team(s)) isn't particularly hard, especially in tournaments with a lot of eyeballs on those replays.

Re: Are We Anti-Cheat Yet?

#78
Anti-Cheat will not help, if the games not Update it for more than 8 month.

And one thing the devs could do without Anti-Cheat, is to automate analysis of e. g. head shot rate, movement speed, etc. but most games not do that. If average player make 25 Kills per hour in a game and some 150 over longer periods i did not need an anti cheat to do something.

Re: Are We Anti-Cheat Yet?

#79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> But are cheaters even an issue in unpopular games Yes. Every game has cheats. The cheat packages are pretty easy to adapt to new games and people pay money for them. Why do people cheat? Because it’s fun! If you’ve never cheated it’s honestly worth trying. It’s hilarious. It also utterly ruins the game for everyone else in the lobby. If games had reliable anti-cheat you’d be shocked at the percentage of lobbies tha…

I'm not talking about developer tools - cheats that come with the game, available in single player (and multiplayer if the host allows it). But a lot of games do also have accessible to everyone replays that show every order given by every player, so catching a cheater that acted on information not available to them (because for instance they had buddies in other team(s)) isn't particularly hard, especially in tourna…

> isn't particularly hard

At scale it’s incredibly hard. Impossibly hard even. So hard no one has successfully solved it! Ever!

But what you’re describing is Valve’s Overwatch system for Counter-Strike. It’s a key component of the anti-cheat ecosystem. But cheating is still rampant in CS and one of the biggest complaints.

Re: Are We Anti-Cheat Yet?

#80
post #78

Anti-Cheat will not help, if the games not Update it for more than 8 month. And one thing the devs could do without Anti-Cheat, is to automate analysis of e. g. head shot rate, movement speed, etc. but most games not do that. If average player make 25 Kills per hour in a game and some 150 over longer periods i did not need an anti cheat to do something.

Yeah it would be so easy to stop cheaters if they only stopped to think about the problem for a few minutes.
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