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Japan cracks down on use of rideable electric suitcases amid tourist boom

theguardian.com

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Re: Japan cracks down on use of rideable electric suitcases amid tourist boom

#71

Post by throwaway2037 »

makeitdouble wrote: post #55
cryptica wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Such a bad regulations. Rideable luggage actually seems reasonably innovative. It sucks how the government often gets in the way of meaningful improvements. Feels like we are really headed for dark ages.

Japan has a very public problem of self powered vehicles running into people/stuff. With an aging population, drivers who mistakingly hit the accel when they meant to brake, thus running full missile mode into shops and sidewalks make the news almost every day("Prius missile") The last things people want is additional vehicles plowing forward at the push of a button, this time indoors and/or on the sidewalk from the…

    > drivers who mistakingly hit the accel when they meant to brake, thus running full missile mode into shops and sidewalks make the news almost every day
"Almost every day"? Hmmm... I do not think so. Wouldn't the same happen in other countries with lots of Prius and old people, like the US?

Re: Japan cracks down on use of rideable electric suitcases amid tourist boom

#72

Post by Johnny555 »

margalabargala wrote: post #40
Johnny555 wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>You're not mad at ebikes, you're mad at people with unregistered vehicles, and potentially drivers driving motorcycles without motorcycle licenses. Yeah, but the problem is that they all look the same, many legal bikes even come with easily removed speed limiters. I'm ok with throwing the baby out with the bathwater -- regulate them all if it's impossible to tell which one is which until they get into an accident.

IMO this can be solved with education and enforcement in equal measure. This is not the first example of there being an easily-abused commons of some sort, where we all benefit from using something within reason but a few bad actors can make things radically worse for everyone. Radio comes to mind. It's very easy for anyone to prevent their neighbors from using their wifi, by trying to boost their own signal strength…

>Speed cameras everywhere, for cars and bicycles.

How do speed cameras help stop speeding bikes when they don't require a license plate?

Re: Japan cracks down on use of rideable electric suitcases amid tourist boom

#73

Post by Dylan16807 »

Danieru wrote: post #26
Sparkyte wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Simple, attach non-functional pedals.

You'd need functional pedals, and for the electric push to be equal or lower than the human motive power.

> for the electric push to be equal or lower than the human motive power

Is that the rule for normal ebikes? That's very restrictive!

Re: Japan cracks down on use of rideable electric suitcases amid tourist boom

#74

Post by nox101 »

throwaway2037 wrote: post #68
nradov wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In China some able-bodied people have started riding electric wheelchairs to get around licensing and usage laws restricting scooters. Some of the wheelchairs are pretty quick now, basically the same drivetrain in a different package.

I tried to Google about this but I could not find anything. Can you share a source?

Do these count?

https://www.google.com/search?q=chinese+fast+motorized+wheel...

No idea if this is real but it was one of the results

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9F5vZmm7isw

Re: Japan cracks down on use of rideable electric suitcases amid tourist boom

#75

Post by teractiveodular »

throwaway2037 wrote: post #71
makeitdouble wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Japan has a very public problem of self powered vehicles running into people/stuff. With an aging population, drivers who mistakingly hit the accel when they meant to brake, thus running full missile mode into shops and sidewalks make the news almost every day("Prius missile") The last things people want is additional vehicles plowing forward at the push of a button, this time indoors and/or on the sidewalk from the…

> drivers who mistakingly hit the accel when they meant to brake, thus running full missile mode into shops and sidewalks make the news almost every day "Almost every day"? Hmmm... I do not think so. Wouldn't the same happen in other countries with lots of Prius and old people, like the US?

Yup, and it does, to the order of 16,000 times per year in the US alone: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sudden_unintended_acceleration

While I'm at it, here's the most famous Prius case in Japan, where a 87-year-old geriatric senior bureaucrat ran over and killed a mother and her child, but was treated with kid gloves until the husband whipped up enough public outrage to force the police to do something about it:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Higashi-Ikebukuro_runaway_car_...

Re: Japan cracks down on use of rideable electric suitcases amid tourist boom

#76

Post by teractiveodular »

blackeyeblitzar wrote: post #34

I can’t help but think Japan’s recent anti tourist mania is going to hurt them significantly. The country already has a reputation for xenophobia and discrimination, and the visibility of social media and news media attacks against tourists over trivial things like this is just going to keep young people from going there. And their economy needs them.

As a recent tourist to Japan (and a fluent speaker/reader of Japanese, so I get both sides of the story), the "anti tourist mania" is ridiculously overhyped by the media. Yeah, there are a couple of overcrowded hotspots, but it's a country of over 100M people and the vast majority of them either couldn't care less or actively welcome the tourist revenue.

Re: Japan cracks down on use of rideable electric suitcases amid tourist boom

#77

Post by [deleted] »

throwaway2037 wrote: post #70
gentile wrote: post #8

A license isn't needed for an electric bicycle. The law states that it is classified as an electric bicycle if it is only pedal assist and only up to 24kph (15mph). The issue arises when either there are no pedals, or it can be operated without using pedals, like these suitcases. Electric only operation moves the classification to a scooter, thus license needed. https://archive.ph/Fw5lX https://www.keishicho.metro.to…

How does Loop work? They are rental electric scooters.

[deleted]

Re: Japan cracks down on use of rideable electric suitcases amid tourist boom

#78

Post by Animats »

There's the Honda Motocompacto.[1] It's more like a rideable electric briefcase. 15mph top speed, 12 mile range.

I saw someone using a Honda Motocompacto as intended yesterday. She rode it into the Redwood City train station, quickly folded it, and easily carried it onto the train.

[1] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hiANpl-hMNA

Re: Japan cracks down on use of rideable electric suitcases amid tourist boom

#79

Post by ianburrell »

erickhill wrote: post #66
lmm wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Bicycles are known and understood by the people you're sharing spaces with; there are rules for where they're allowed and where they're not allowed and how they have to behave. The Japanese laws essentially allow ebikes that mimic bikes very closely to be used as bikes; otherwise you have to follow the rules for a scooter/moped (which is, after all, what you are).

I wish more places were like this. I'll be riding my bike in a designated a bike lane (which is sometimes shared with pedestrians, dogs, etc.) with clearly marked speed limit signs of 15mph. That's plenty fast in general, but even more so in busy spots. And suddenly a near-silent e-bike will go flying past me (no "On your left," by the way) at speeds close to 30mph. Happens all of the time and is bafflingly reckless…

Legally, in many places they are mopeds. The problem is that there is no way to enforce the law because they look like e-bikes. It takes checking model numbers of bike or components. Throttle is relatively easy to notice.

Re: Japan cracks down on use of rideable electric suitcases amid tourist boom

#80

Post by stubish »

GuB-42 wrote: post #6
bootloop wrote: post #3

They need a new vehicle category? Why does an electric bicycle need a driver license in the first place?

I think that part is wrong. You don't need a license to ride an e-bike in Japan. However, what would be an e-bike in some other country would be classified as a moped in Japan, requiring a driver's license. In particular, the amount of assistance an e-bike can provide is limited, some power has to come from the rider to be classified as an e-bike. So it is possible that because of some quirks of the Japanese regulati…

I think the classification is pretty standard. A bicycle has pedals. A motorcycle/moped does not. Legal definitions start drifting by region about things like can you ride an e-bike without using the pedals or maximum speeds. So I doubt anywhere would consider these bicycles. What is more interesting to me is if it fits into the same category as mobility scooter, wheelchair or golf buggy. Over here in my state, mobility scooters are only legal in public if you are injured, have difficulty walking or other disability. Electric scooters were entirely illegal until recently, unless they were under powered enough to be classified as a toy (which was so low they where incapable of transporting a teenager or adult)
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