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Women who make Samsung semiconductors are striking

english.hani.co.kr

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Re: Women who make Samsung semiconductors are striking

#71

Post by vivekd »

hammock wrote: post #56
theamk wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Have you seen "good vs services employment" graphs, like this one? [0] Number of people producing goods has been shrinking for a longest time, its under 20% now. It'll likely keep shrinking as automation becomes more advanced, and in the future "service" would be much more important. When I was a kid, I've read some sci-fi stories about societies like those, where most people were working in service industry. [0] htt…

That graph is US only

Good point - the graph being US only means it misses offshoring manufacturing jobs to places like China. We can't assume that the loss of manufacturing jobs was solely caused by automation

Re: Women who make Samsung semiconductors are striking

#72

Post by Alupis »

wormlord wrote: post #70
Alupis wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> "you'll basically have zero wlb for the first 2-3 years while we are getting this fab off the ground" This doesn't sound like you were interviewing for a typical job with Samsung then. Getting a fab off the ground seems to imply it's a newly constructed, or under construction fab. You were interviewing to be part of the crew that builds and sets up a new fab. There's a reason salaries for this type of work as so la…

That's fair enough. The salary was not high though lol.

I'm just curious - was this a US based fab as part of the CHIPS Act fallout, or a fab in Korea? I would assume salaries are localized to COL.

Re: Women who make Samsung semiconductors are striking

#73

Post by Blackthorn »

kybernetikos wrote: post #51
Blackthorn wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They always owned the police anyway.

True but police are people too with their own expectations and morality and the number of police required to suppress a population is relatively large. There's still enormous room for abuse, but automating suppression drops even the imperfect checks that we have on the power of the few to oppress the many

It's a historical fact that the police (or police-adjacent things before they were called the police) have always been quite willing to crack the skulls of workers.

Re: Women who make Samsung semiconductors are striking

#74

Post by SI_Rob »

galdosdi wrote: post #66
ryandrake wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> 1. Some workers lose their jobs to automation. > 2. The remaining ones have a weaker negotiation power, as their jobs are on the way out anyway. So companies have even more incentive to abuse them. I wonder what the eventual end game is, when you let everything play out to its logical conclusion. Eventually, business owners will no longer need people at all. They'll own a magical fully-automated factory that mainta…

Not even. Humanity would consist of a small elite who owns everything, a small, continually shrinking middle class that consists of the remaining few workers who are actually needed for some reason (eventually, this tiny middle class would shrink to just the members of boards of directors, or something -- someone has to supervise the machines even if it's just rubber stamping them) and a vast underclass experiencing…

I dread that we are going to see a _lot_ of of cults appear, and a disturbing concentration of political power around cult leadership as a social modality. With a large overlap with the despair-distraction-escapism industry as entertainers become increasingly valorized into spiritual and thought leaders, and eventually leaders, full stop.

They will, as did monarchs in feudal times, draw their power base from the multitude of disenfranchised commoners seeking guidance, respite from the bleak outlook for those with little or no prospect of upward mobility, and a rallying point from which to focus any semblance of pushback against the landed baronial classes. But they will all the while be paying a hefty tax to those who maintain the broadcast infrastructure that enables them to marshall and monetize their followers, so even these kings and queens will need to stay in the graces of some potentate or other.

Re: Women who make Samsung semiconductors are striking

#76

Post by mewpmewp2 »

Ajedi32 wrote: post #48
dangrossman wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The fictional automated business may cost tens of billions of dollars to build. That means almost no one, not literally anyone, can create it. If a small group of giant conglomerates are the only companies wealthy enough to build these automated factories, then there's no competition to drive down prices, and no automatic path to a post-scarcity society. Instead, it's the dystopia ryandrake described.

> If a small group of giant conglomerates are the only companies wealthy enough to build these automated factories So AI can build everything except the factory itself? Sounds like there's still a need for human labor. And if the opposite is true and AI can build the factory, then it's not going to "cost tens of billions of dollars to build"; the factory will be just as cheap as the goods its producing. Literally eve…

Maybe the resources, materials and land is the constraint here.

So whoever builds the first one will be able to quickly expand, buy more land and solidify their lead.

Land is likely what would cost billions in this specific scenario.

If you don't have land or materials then there is nothing your AI can do, because it doesn't have anything to build things from.

Re: Women who make Samsung semiconductors are striking

#77

Post by amelius »

ryandrake wrote: post #13
abdullahkhalids wrote: post #7

> Samsung’s 12-inch line utilizes an overhead hoist transport (OHT) system, an automated transport network that operates along tracks installed on the ceiling, to move bundles of 25 wafers called “lots.” On the 8-inch line, however, this transportation is done manually. There is much more market demand for 12-inch wafers, so Samsung has modernized and automated many processes. The 8-inch line, however, is outdated. W…

> 1. Some workers lose their jobs to automation. > 2. The remaining ones have a weaker negotiation power, as their jobs are on the way out anyway. So companies have even more incentive to abuse them. I wonder what the eventual end game is, when you let everything play out to its logical conclusion. Eventually, business owners will no longer need people at all. They'll own a magical fully-automated factory that mainta…

That's not the end game because ultimately voters determine the rules of the economic system.

And if voting doesn't work, there's the possibility of a revolution.

So the capital owners will probably make it so that they please a majority of people just enough to stay in power.

Re: Women who make Samsung semiconductors are striking

#78

Post by wormlord »

Alupis wrote: post #72
wormlord wrote: post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's fair enough. The salary was not high though lol.

I'm just curious - was this a US based fab as part of the CHIPS Act fallout, or a fab in Korea? I would assume salaries are localized to COL.

USA
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